khp Posted July 29, 2015 Report Share Posted July 29, 2015 So we've seen Marc Marquez crash out of three races in the first half of 2015, in all three cases from second position. I went through the points to see how the championship would have looked like, if he had scored second places in those three races: Marc Marquez: 114 + 20 + 20 + 20 = 174 pts Valentino Rossi: 179 - 0 - 3 - 4 = 172 pts Jorge Lorenzo: 166 - 1 - 0 - 0 = 165 pts Andrea Iannone: 118 - 2 - 4 - 2 = 110 pts Andrea Dovizioso: 87 - 4 - 0 - 0 = 83 pts For each of the riders I've simply taken their current points and then deducted the amount of point they would have lost by Marc finishing second. Since Jorge won two of the three races in question, he would only loose a single point, whereas Iannone looses out 8 points. So, if Marc had been given the same advice as was given to Kevin Schwantz*, he would have been leading the championship by two points. Do I think that Marc's done and over this year? No, not at all. All it takes is a little crash from Rossi and/or Lorenzo to mix things up quite a bit. And there's still 9 races to go. *) "There's no bonus for being first in the first corner, being first at the end of the first lap. Only bonus is for passing the finishing line. So let's just go out there and see how things goes" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Kane Posted July 29, 2015 Report Share Posted July 29, 2015 Kai; When we look at dominating riders like Rossi, Lorenzo, Stoner or further back to rides like Mick Doohan, Roberts, Mike the Bike or Ago, all of them took a year or two before they become really competitive enough to win their first championship at the MotoGP level. Then you look at Marquez who won the championship in his rookie season (2013) and then followed up with a more dominate second championship in 2014 and it makes you wonder how anyone could do that considering those who preceded him. I know I don't know a lot about MotoGP but I don't think anyone has won a championship as a rookie and then successfully defended it the following year. Where I think the difference in Marquez's performance this year surrounds the bike more than the rider as Yamaha has won 7 of the first 9 races so far. Marquez was as you said in second in all three crashes but IIRC, 2 of his 3 happened when he was trying to pass for the lead and/or win. You're right about where he would be if he listened to Schwantz's advice but he clearly doesn't like to finish a race in second place. HRC might be giving up something to Yamaha that they haven't figured out yet but the summer break will give them time to adjust. If they can close the gap the second half of 2015 could be more fun that the first. I agree with you that this thing is far from being over. I don't remember a more exciting season than this one in a long time. I wonder what others up here think? Kevin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmckeen Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 My understanding of the current MotoGP situation is that Honda has screwed themselves with a new Engine design that mostly suffers from too small a fly wheel and produces to much engine brake. They cannot fix this mid season due to the Engine development being frozen. I believe they have fallen for the age old trap of adding more horsepower and getting slower lap times as a result Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khp Posted July 30, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 Kai; When we look at dominating riders like Rossi, Lorenzo, Stoner or further back to rides like Mick Doohan, Roberts, Mike the Bike or Ago, all of them took a year or two before they become really competitive enough to win their first championship at the MotoGP level. Then you look at Marquez who won the championship in his rookie season (2013) and then followed up with a more dominate second championship in 2014 and it makes you wonder how anyone could do that considering those who preceded him. I know I don't know a lot about MotoGP but I don't think anyone has won a championship as a rookie and then successfully defended it the following year. Where I think the difference in Marquez's performance this year surrounds the bike more than the rider as Yamaha has won 7 of the first 9 races so far. Marquez was as you said in second in all three crashes but IIRC, 2 of his 3 happened when he was trying to pass for the lead and/or win. You're right about where he would be if he listened to Schwantz's advice but he clearly doesn't like to finish a race in second place. HRC might be giving up something to Yamaha that they haven't figured out yet but the summer break will give them time to adjust. If they can close the gap the second half of 2015 could be more fun that the first. I agree with you that this thing is far from being over. I don't remember a more exciting season than this one in a long time. I wonder what others up here think? Kevin I agree that Marc is a once-in-10/20 years talent. Rossi came second in championship in his first season (49 pts down on KR Jr), and Burgess and Rossi put this down to the fact that they didn't push for the victories immediately, according to Rossi's autobiography. BTW, anyone knows what Jeremy Burgess is doing these days - did he hang up his tools and go into retirement? Very exciting season so far, even if there have only been 3 riders / 2 teams winning so far! I think we're in for a treat in the second half and that Marc (and Dani, I hope) will be winning much more. My understanding of the current MotoGP situation is that Honda has screwed themselves with a new Engine design that mostly suffers from too small a fly wheel and produces to much engine brake. They cannot fix this mid season due to the Engine development being frozen. I haven't heard about the Honda engine design change. Clearly I'm not following all rumour sites - got a link to share? The one thing that I have seen, which is what Honda have been acknowledging themselves: that the 2015 chassis is not 'forgiving' enough so if Marc makes a mistake, he's more likely to crash. They changed back to the 2014 chassis (but with a "2015B" spec swingarm) for the last two races (Assen and Sachsenring), and Marc is much happier with that combo, and it seems like that Dani is getting back to his old self, running for podiums and wins again. I'm still hoping for Ducati and Suzuki to find some extra speed to really challenge The Aliens for the wins, that would be really fun. Unfortunately, I'm not sure they have the riders to do that so far - only one that's won a GP is Dovi, and his only win in MotoGP was back in 2009 on a Repsol Honda. Maybe Maverick Viñales in the future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fritzdacat Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 I haven't heard about the Honda engine design change. Clearly I'm not following all rumour sites - got a link to share? I heard Marques say that in an interview too , so the info is valid IMHO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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