Decrease Turn-How To Handle?

[wandyhee]

riding on the road we're not familiar with, where the turn hidden behind the hill and decrease, is it safe to do more counter steering to compensate with decrease turn? or is it any other way to handle this situation?

[BLSJDS]

Yes - you can safely add lean angle to stay on line in a decreasing radius turn. However, it is NOT safe to add lean angle AND throttle at the same time. Steady (or "maintenance") throttle generally works best on the street in this type of situation when adding lean angle.

 

Depending on the corner, lean angle, amount of correction needed, etc - you could also gently roll off the throttle (but not all the way) and the decrease in speed coupled with the slight weight transfer forward will tighten up your line as well.

 

But it's worth repeating - do not add lean angle AND throttle.

[richard_m_h]

Hook turn!

[tmckeen]

Depending on how much the radius is decreasing the hook turn or even just more "body english" can be very useful to tighten your line, but those techniques are somewhat dependent on setting up for the turn properly to begin with. If your not already locked in and shifted slightly to the inside applying those techniques mid corner might have some less desirable results then you intend.

[Lnewqban]

riding on the road we're not familiar with, where the turn hidden behind the hill and decrease, is it safe to do more counter steering to compensate with decrease turn? or is it any other way to handle this situation?

It is safe if you still have a safety margin regarding traction (you are not at maximum lean).

If you have no cushion angle, just read this post:

http://forums.superbikeschool.com/index.php?showtopic=3438&view=findpost&p=28191

[wandyhee]

thanks for the inputs everyone, and yes BLSJDS, i'll remember that - more lean angle, less throttle

[wandyhee]

OK, back on track where I practice, there's also decrease turn radius, which I call it TURN X in pic below:

 

 

direction are indicate by black arrow, my plan to ride this turn is get to 1st turn point (red dot), and from there try to get the straightest line with consistent speed, and get ready for second turn point (also red dot). haven't try this plan yet as I haven't had a chance to go to track this few weeks, but would you guys think this will be best bet for this decrease turn?

[mckeann]

what i would do is trail brake past the first apex, drift to the outside of the track, get off the brakes and get it turned for the second apex. My turn point would would be out near the kerb, between your TP2 and the black arrow.

[wandyhee]

that does make sense for faster accelerate out of turn

[BLSJDS]

That's a tough one, and I'd really have to take that corner a few times to figure out the best approach for me. Sometimes the map just doesn't do it justice.

 

You may find that you can turn in much earlier, with more speed, in the first part of the turn (from the left side of the track, above the capital "T" in the word "Turn"), apex right above and slightly to the left of where you have the "X", drive out to the left side of the track (almost where you have the last arrow), and then turn it quickly, apex below the "X", and drive out hard.

 

I suck at map illustrations and really didn't do a good job describing it, but hopefully you get the idea. I think Neil and I might be saying the same thing.

[wandyhee]

yup, it's clearly the same idea from both of you, i'll do some plan (drawing) just like both of you 2 advise and work it out whenever I have chance to spend my time for practice sometimes this weekend. I do still have trauma on this turn as I used to spill after hitting the inside curb (slightly higher than road surface) of those second apex..result of no riding plan and and thought it's just another constant radius turn.

[Hotfoot]

what i would do is trail brake past the first apex, drift to the outside of the track, get off the brakes and get it turned for the second apex. My turn point would would be out near the kerb, between your TP2 and the black arrow.

 

 

+1, I think this is the approach I'd try, too.

 

Question- what are you gaining by going out to the left where you've marked your first turn point? I'm assuming that your prior turn ends you up on the right side of the track, so you have to cross to the left - what is the advantage of that left entrance, versus a mid-track entrance - do you get better visibility, or better pavement, or a more favorable camber, etc.? (I'm not saying it's right or wrong, just asking you for your reasons.)

 

Also, what sort of bike are you riding? Is it high or low horsepower? Sharp handling or not? These are factors to consider when making a plan - what are the strengths and weaknesses of YOUR bike and YOUR riding, and how can you make best use of those?