Jump to content

Recommended Posts

I just watched a few races from 1992 and was stunned by how much smoother and in control they looked back then compared to today! I remember the 1980s, when the big two-strokes were bucking and weaving and protesting - especially Gardner's Honda - but by 1992, all was calm. Hardly a wheel off line at any point, nor a wobble or a weave. The only thing similar with today was that there seemed to be next to no warning before they lost the front or, in a few cases, got high-sided. 

If you watched the COTA race, you will have seen many riders sliding, wobbling and bobbing quite a bit, lap after lap. Now, do you think this is a result of the electronic aids allowing them to be less accurate, or that they race closer to the ragged edge today or something else?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
48 minutes ago, faffi said:

I just watched a few races from 1992 and was stunned by how much smoother and in control they looked back then compared to today! I remember the 1980s, when the big two-strokes were bucking and weaving and protesting - especially Gardner's Honda - but by 1992, all was calm. Hardly a wheel off line at any point, nor a wobble or a weave. The only thing similar with today was that there seemed to be next to no warning before they lost the front or, in a few cases, got high-sided. 

If you watched the COTA race, you will have seen many riders sliding, wobbling and bobbing quite a bit, lap after lap. Now, do you think this is a result of the electronic aids allowing them to be less accurate, or that they race closer to the ragged edge today or something else?

COTA's track had a lot of complaints from riders being very bumpy.  At turn 10 where I was stationed this year, there was a very good bump that got the bikes quite unsettled if they hit it and caused a couple spectacular tank slappers and get-offs over the weekend.  The perimeter roads we took to get on station were bumpy as could be as well.

Plus todays MotoGP bikes are around 260 HP; quite a bit more than 1990's bikes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I just mentioned COTA since it was the most recent race, but if you are a motogp.com member and watch races from the 90s and compare them with races of today, it seems like the bikes currently seems closer to the ragged edge.

In 1992 the 500GP bikes probably had around 190 hp and weighed just 130 kg, so power-to-weight was in the ballpark. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, faffi said:

I just mentioned COTA since it was the most recent race, but if you are a motogp.com member and watch races from the 90s and compare them with races of today, it seems like the bikes currently seems closer to the ragged edge.

In 1992 the 500GP bikes probably had around 190 hp and weighed just 130 kg, so power-to-weight was in the ballpark. 

Starting last year, they went to a spec ECU which all teams must run.  This was done to "even up" the racing.  For example, Honda's factory ECU technology was rumored to use GPS technology to adjust the bike for each corner; a technology not available (or affordable) to non-factory teams.

So per some factory teams the spec ECU is about 5-10 years behind what the top factory was running.

Even in 1992 the 500's were brutal.  1993 was Wayne Raineys career ending crash.  Kevin Schwantz had some pretty spectacular get-offs during that period.

I think the current 4-strokes are easier to ride at the edge and live to tell the tale where the 2-strokes bit without warning.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, DLHamblin said:

I think the current 4-strokes are easier to ride at the edge and live to tell the tale where the 2-strokes bit without warning.

This is a very good point, the power band for two strokes is a much different curve, the power hits really hard and it is not nearly as linear as current 4-stroke bikes. Tires are better, too, more predictable. Just those two factors alone probably make a big difference on being able to slide and wiggle a lot without actually crashing, compared to the older 500Gp bikes. And that's before even taking into account the advancements in suspension and frames.

I do agree that they are really riding on the edge - I am always amazed, watching the races, how far they are willing to push those bikes.

Maybe the better safety gear is a factor, too, keeping those bravest-of-the-brave riders in the game, rather than suffering injuries that limit or end their riding careers.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Hotfoot said:

This is a very good point, the power band for two strokes is a much different curve, the power hits really hard and it is not nearly as linear as current 4-stroke bikes. Tires are better, too, more predictable. Just those two factors alone probably make a big difference on being able to slide and wiggle a lot without actually crashing, compared to the older 500Gp bikes. And that's before even taking into account the advancements in suspension and frames.

I do agree that they are really riding on the edge - I am always amazed, watching the races, how far they are willing to push those bikes.

Maybe the better safety gear is a factor, too, keeping those bravest-of-the-brave riders in the game, rather than suffering injuries that limit or end their riding careers.

Yes, most of the time they are up telling us how/why they crashed or asking for a ride back to pits before the bike is even recovered.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would venture its definitely a result of the electronics and the nature of the 4 stroke engine.  Two stroke engines don't have anywhere near as much engine brake as 4 strokes which is just one of the many things that can be fine tuned on a corner by corner basis with the current electronics.  Combined with the fact that were are seeing the results of the Moto2 feeder Class vs the old 250GP class.  Personally I can see some parallels between the riders in Moto2 and a FMX biggest whip competition.

The bikes are more predictable on the limit,  the riders are more comfortable at the limit and the electronics have made the limit more accessibl

Also the nature of the crashes seems to have changed,  I don't see a lot of really nasty high sides,  most of the time it seems like the riders lose the front which makes for a less painful and damaging slide along the tarmac without the hard landing.

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

×
×
  • Create New...