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Good read indeed! I'm celebrating my fiftieth year of riding, and I can relate completely.
- Today
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Yes, I see it now. It is a very slight roll off for sure. It is so slight I had to watch the rpm needle to pick it up. Very impressive throttle control! Thanks Keith.
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I like the sound of this👍 My line always leads me too near the inside of #4 - what is they say about every day being a schoolday!
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Thanks for purring this to my attention, s I missed it the first time!
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WHR changed their profile photo
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None of this makes much sense.
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Look again. He rolls it off to get it pointed up the hill to #4 right before and just after the second apex. The uphill magnifies the slight roll off to bring the bike around and minimize lean on the exit and his getting max gas towards #4. If you look closely, the speed at the second apex goes down, only 1 mph, but that's enough to get it pointed. At least for him 🙂 In addition, that slight roll off transfers weight to the front allowing the bike to turn a tighter arc at that point. KC
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Very nice! Completely agree about 2-strokes being a ton of fun - road an early 70's Hodaka Super Rat (remember those?) as a kid.
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2020 Riding Coach Search
Graybeard replied to Cobie Fair's topic in School Questions/General Discussion
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Here is Will's lap from 2014 … https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TFjm8cJ-z9g Here is what I think I see, but check me on this. Will has a nice roll-on out of T2. Then rolls completely off the throttle and trail brakes pretty hard before he gets to the T3 turn point. It looks like he carries his trail brake past the turn point but ends it well before the first apex. It also looks like he is back on the throttle before the first apex as well and holds it essentially steady (just a very slight increase in rpms) through the middle of the turn and second apex. He then rolls on as he exits.
- Yesterday
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Very interesting article, and one thing I like to do in this regard is to practice in a parking lot at slow speeds, (20 to 30 mph) to work on head, feet, leg, hand, and arm positions. I can also work on throttle control at the same time.
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2000 KX 250 (2-stroke). What a hoot to ride. I know the 4-strokes can be a bit easier, but it sure is easy to start when I watch the other guys kicking the pea-waddin out of their 450's. Saw that Gorman is now closed, and really...I don't get it. Can easily practice social distancing. We are seeing if we can get to the other BLM land, hope that stays open!
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My internet is stalled, I can't get the video up of Will riding at Streets...can anyone get to that, let's see what he is doing with the throttle there.
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Thank you for the discussions, hope there will be more! I used a time stamped link, but apparently that did not work - sorry for that!
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I'm curious Cobie, what is your off-road / dirt motorcycle?
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Took a quick look at video footage from L4 training and CODE Race last fall. I roll on, have a slight roll off, then roll on again. Ditto on this comment by Hotfoot.
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I usually roll on, roll off, roll on again, but if I am going as fast as I can go and traction is good, I come in faster, and I'm slowing down all the way to mid-corner, and I don't open the throttle at all until I am pointed at the second apex. I can carry in a lot more speed that way, but it is hard to stay relaxed on the bars, I only ride it that way when I know I can be relaxed and confident and I really trust the traction. Overall I feel safer using roll on/roll off/roll on in that corner, especially if my tires are not fully warmed up or traction is not good (when the track is wet, for example).
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What do you mean by this? Do you mean you enter at mid-track? Or farther to the inside than that? I find that if enter that turn on the inside I either have to slow way down, or I end up wide on the exit and that messes up the entry to 5.
- Last week
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If Eddie had to back out, wouldn't he have rolled off the throttle tightening up his line in relation to the corner versus running wide? On the other hand, I guess if he had to get on the front brake as part of backing off that could have caused him to come up and wide.
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Looks like Eddie was going for the inside pass, had to back out when he wasn't going to make it and when he did ran wide and tagged Schwantz's rear.
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Yeah I don't worry too much about a wide entry into T-4.
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Suggest watching it on YouTube here ... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=omk5sHY2xwI&feature=emb_err_watch_on_yt To see the accident jump to 17:00 time marker. 17:45 shows it in slow motion. To pull apart what happened I think there are three things we could try to understand: (1) What was each rider's racing line coming into the corner and trajectory at point of impact? (2) Given their individual racing lines where was each rider's actual apex point for turn 1? (3) What was the relative speed and motorcycle attitude (i.e, accelerating vs decelerating / braking, going into more or less lean angle, etc.) for each? From what I see Kevin Schwantz is further to the left side of the track coming into the Turn 1 (right hander) and on a wider, faster, more open racing line than Eddie Lawson, who was carrying more initial speed to grab the inside line at the corner's entrance. Given the camera angle it is hard to see exactly where each rider's actual apex point was - they may very well have been charging for the same apex - but it looks to me like Eddie's apex point was a little earlier in the corner then Kevin's. Schwantz does carry more speed through the corner and is leaned over longer than Eddie, coming across Lawson's front tire with an apparent trajectory to cut off the inside line in the middle & late sections of the corner. After he hits his apex Lawson seems to stand his bike up as Schwantz comes across his front, but I don't think I would characterize it as a pre-accident panic pick up. In fact, when you try to go frame by frame it looks like Lawson's pick up may really be because they had touched (Kevin's rear wheel to Eddie's front), which would cause a reaction like Eddie's from all of us. I think my conclusion is Kevin came across too tight and clipped Lawson's front end in his effort to close off the inside line. However Lawson's intended trajectory may have been to move further to the left on exit given he was in the process of bringing the bike up, so not exactly helping matters. Not sure how this was ultimately evaluated by MotoGP officials but would guess it was just chalked up as a racing incident.
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So, to clarify; as I am treating it as a single apex turn, I'm about 5 feet from the edge of where the first kerb starts, bringing my line in closer to it as I ride up to my (the 2nd) apex (and not paying too much attention to the first one). I'll take that though.👍 Yes, it could, and I could run it tighter. A tighter first apex would let the bike come out from the kerb, rounding off the corner more so than I probably would be doing, and allow for a tighter trajectory in on the 2nd apex, which would really let you drive the bike up the hill, get it picked up sooner, and set up a good entry into #4. As I enter wider, I exit wider, which is why my entry to turn 4 never seems right - crescendo effect - lightbulbs going on😀 There is only one way to remedy this....
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I can't play the video, it says it is blocked.
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Planning on a little social distancing at Gorman, on Sat April 11 or maybe even Sunday, April 12. In case other's might want to socially distance themselves to an OHV area (providing still open).
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Love to watch the whole thing, but at work...can you say what minute the crash occurs?
