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Showing content with the highest reputation on 04/01/2019 in all areas

  1. 1 point
    The book that you have mentioned has the answer to your original question: "What makes the bike turn the same as it was leaned more without hanging off? It is explained in Chapter 3: Less lean angle requires more effective steering angle in order to keep the same radius of turn (please, see figure 3.18 of page 3-13): "Increasing lean angle tends to increase the effective steering angle." It is a simple geometrical problem, there is no need to complicate it with camber thrust, slip angles, etc., because the magnitudes of the forces of cornering and the dynamic lean angle remain the same, either or not you hang-off. The chassis reduces its lean angle when the rider hangs-off while cornering, which changes the relative geometry among the three planes: the ones containing the rear tire, the steered front tire and the curve (track surface).  You may want to do the following experiment: Fill up a wide recipient with water (the surface of the water will work like the plane of the curve). Make a central 10-degree bend in a small rectangular piece of cardboard (one side will work like the plane containing the rear tire and the other side like the plane of the front tire). Keeping the bent edge and both sides vertical, deep the piece of cardboard into the water. Looking from above, turn the cardboard just like a bike would lean over to turn and note how the angle formed between both lines that intersect the surface of the water and each side of the cardboard gets bigger as the lean angle increases. That angle is the effective (or kinetic) steering angle, which would force the bike to turn tighter (reduced radius of turn) if the rider would not compensate for this phenomena by steering a little less. If that experiment still does not convince you, we could use the following well stablished formula: Radius of turn = [Wheelbase x Cosine of chassis lean angle] / [Steer angle x Cosine of caster angle] As wheelbase gets a little bit smaller and caster angle remains constant, when the rider hangs off while cornering, the cosine of the chassis lean angle increases (example: cos 45=0.707 and cos 40=0.766). That change would increase the radius of turn some, making the bike run wide respect to the desired trajectory. In order to avoid that from happening, the rider must compensate by increasing the steer angle a little. Another geometrical way to analize that: Imagine a perfectly vertical line running underground by the center of the circular trajectory of the motorcycle. Disregarding slip and camber thrust, the extended axis of both wheels must intersect with that vertical line. As those wheels are leaned more, the point of intersection moves deeper into the ground, which reduces the angle formed between the extended axis of both wheels. Hence, the steering angle must be reduced some in order for the bike to keep tracing the same circular trajectory.  A leaned motorcycle will always have an effective steering angle that is smaller than the one for a 4-wheel vehicle describing the same curve.  The exercise of Motorcycle Gymkhana is a different solution to a problem that is different: make the tightest quick turn around a cone. The maximum speed at maximum lean angle will make you slower in this particular case, try that experiment as well. Since speed must be much smaller than during normal Superbike track cornering, the smallest radius of turn of the rear tire is the key to turn the bike 180 degrees as quickly as possible. For the same reason explained above, the Gymkhana rider wants the chassis to be as leaned as possible during the slowest section of the tight turn. At full stop lock of the steering, the radius of turn (and the circular trajectory of both tires) will be smaller as the chassis lean angle increases: there is a greater effective steering angle. Lock the steering of a bicycle at a pronounced angle and push it while at different sustained lean angles for each completed circle and you will see that the smallest circle corresponds with the biggest lean angle. For the above formula and description of angles, please see "Steering angle" here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bicycle_and_motorcycle_dynamics
  2. 1 point
    It's a combination of camber thrust and steering angle. At a 45 degree lean angle, the profile of the tire generates alot of camber thrust, like when you roll a cone on the ground, it rolls in circles. Camber thrust at 45 degrees makes the bike want to turn at a radius of about 5 - 10 feet depending on your specific tire profile. This radius is much less of a radius we negotiate at the track. This is why we can have situations where the front wheel is actually pointing towards the outside of the turn during cornering rather than the inside. That is because camber thrust is TOO large. without a rider on a bike, if it leans to 45 degrees at 100 meter radius is 112km/h If you add a rider and rider is sitting on bike in the center same condition. 45 deg, 100m 112km/h If rider is hanging off, 2 things can happen: 1) bike is leaning 43 degrees 100 meter radius 112km/h (contact patch to center of gravity angle is now 45 deg) 2) bike is still leaning 45 deg 100 meter radius ~120km/h (contact patch to center of gravity angle is now 47 deg) Hanging off the bike reduces bike lean angle, so suspension works more efficiently and you gain more mechanical grip regardless of the coefficient of friction of your tire. If you hang off the bike alot, you reduce the effect of camber thrust, and your front tire will have to turn more into the corner. If you are a beginner rider, you do not need to hang off the bike because you don't need the extra 1% suspension effectiveness. A bike doesn't fall because the steering rack can turn. It's not the rotating mass of the wheels. If you weld your steering column so the front wheel cannot turn, your bike will fall.
  3. 1 point
    To directly answer your question: more handlebar turn. Same radius and speed, but less lean angle would be more turn of the handlebar into the turn.
  4. 1 point
    Your language is good enough for us to communicate about dynamic of motorcycles, my English is not much better. According to Newton, everything that has some speed wants to move on a straight line by itself and must be forced to turn. The forces of steering (wheels pointing in different directions) and friction between tires and pavement are the only things that force a car, truck or a motorcycle to turn, not the lean of the bike. A motorcycle can be leaned and still move on a straight trajectory if both tires are kept perfectly aligned forward. We only lean the bike to create a balance of forces between gravity and centrifugal effect and that balance is kept during the turn regardless of how much the rider hangs off. The more you lean a bike, the less misalignment both tires must have to keep the same circular trajectory and the front contact patch moves away from the rear one, which means less steering is needed (although the difference may not be noticeable). One of the reasons is that the distance at which the axis lines of both tires intersect each other must increase as the bike is leaned in order to keep the same horizontal radius of the curve. Please, take a look at these schematics and text in Italian: http://www.dynamotion.it/eng/dinamoto/8_on-line_papers/Pneumatici/Pneumatici_ita.htm
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