Cryo
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Posts posted by Cryo
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I think driving a car on the track is like walking on level ground. Where riding fast is like walking on a tight roap.
That's a great way of putting it into words.
I think the best way to learn how to read motorcycle tyre grip is to start with a low-grip situation, like riding on gravel. That means you must learn to cope with the tyres sliding. They will also slide with a lot less lean, meaning you're more likely to save yourself from crashing. Once you've learned to stop with skidding tyres, accelerate with a spinning tyre and turn with sliding tyres with mediocre grip, you can take it to another level with a bit more grip, but not a lot. Like a dusty parking lot or using hard touring type tyres on low-grip asphalt. The more you practice, the better you'll become.
I have done a bit of riding in the dirt/gravel and I agree 100% that is probably the best place to start to learn control. Just need to get out there more. One thing I did learn was street tires on a logging road with snow does not equal control
I'll take my bike out to some gravel roads again over the break and try some things. I rode a friends trail bike that had suspension that was stiffer than can be and it rattled my bones loose but it did give me more feedback.
I wish we had dirt track racing around here, that would be a great place to learn.
One thing to add: correct technique will make a huge difference on the potential traction. In other words, one rider can go through a turn and get the bike sliding around, another can go through the same turn and have a margin, not yet at the limits.
Also, how to successfully explore the limits, with some consistency and not ending up on your head regularly.
CF
True true, I am definitely of the former, not going to fast but already at the limit.
Cryo,
Have you studied Keith Code books and DVD?
Your questions suggest that you have not.
It is natural that you are concerned about the interface rubber-pavement; however, there is much more about properly riding a motorcycle, either street or track, which requires careful study and abundant practice.
Read this article:
I have read both books, watched both DVD's and I have read that article.
Just trying to learn new good habits.
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Hey everybody got a question about 'how to feel the traction in the tires'?
I remember Ricky Carmichael saying once that near the end of his long career he could just look at the dirt in front him and know the amount of traction he was going to have.
Coming from the car world and tracking/autcrossing I learned how to feel the amount of traction my car had front or rear through the sounds the tires made and steering input/butt-o-meter.
Now in the bike world I feel like I have to relearn everything(which is not a problem)
Background: Did a bit of racing with minibikes YSR 80. Now I ride a supermoto DRZ400 with Michelin Power Pures and in the summer season get to practice supermoto track pretty much every week.
Areas I would like to have a better feel for how much traction I have in either front or rear tire(how close am I to the limit):
Corner Entry on the brakes (Front tire)
Mid corner( front tire)
Mid corner initial throttle applied (rear tire)
Corner exit rolling on more throttle( rear tire)
Currently I'm too 'scared' to run deep into corners with the front brake because I can't feel when the front is going to let go.
I have had two crashes on the track which were carbon copies of each other just turning different directions. Both were sharp >90 degree corners in 1st gear. Corners I was feeling very comfortable with. I may have been leaning the bike too far over because the first time I crashed the preceding few laps I was scrapping my footpeg. The second time I was chasing somebody on a faster bike. What happened was that I would get to the apex or just before and crack the throttle open as smoothly as I could and then or just after the rear tire would break loose with no warning and step out, and come around. I lowsided both times I think because I made no effort to recover the slide which might turn in to a highside.
I spoke with some of the faster riders at the track and they suggested I may have just run out of tire grip. This is entirely possible since the tires I was running were 4 months old. I am concerned about the way the rear let go, there was no warning like there is when I step the back out on corner exit.
I can upload the clips of the crashes if that would help but they are not that exciting.
Cheers
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Minibikes are another option - riding something like an NSR50 on a go kart track is cheap track time (often under $40 per day) and a great way to lean WAY over without have to go 90 mph to do it.
+1 Minibikes are a super fun/cheap way to get leaned over and learn some racing techniques.
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Good to be here
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Wow that was a sweet pass at the end!
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Hey everybody,
Just checking in from the rainy pacific northwest here in British Columbia.
Cheers!
Hello From Canada
in School Questions/General Discussion
Posted
I ride a supermoto. Commute to work on it, go to the track every other week in the summer. I ride logging roads and do some technical single track on a trials bike. Before that I raced some mini bikes which was about the most fun I've had on a bike yet.
I'm trying to work on what Mr. Code calls the "Band of Traction".