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Rossi Sticking Out His Leg - Why?

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This weekend, it looked like the the later he was braking, the more he did it. The announcers said "even the riders don't know why they do it, but they say it just feels better"

 

It looked like a few toughed their foot a couple times on the ground! :-o And it almost looked like it made Lorenzo (I think) lose it when it happened...

 

it's odd, but it looks like more and more riders are doing it now.

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Rossi made an interesting comment the other day regarding the leg out thing...he said '' I don't know why i do it.....but i know why everyone else dose it''.......Classic statment !!!!

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In this month's Road Racing World, Rossi says, in a description of going into a right hand turn, he feels like he can brake harder when he takes his foot off the peg. He also says he locks his arms during braking and that he relies on electronics a lot now.

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Same comment from a Bike Magazine interview of Rossi. It helped him brake better. The photo was of him with his right foot off the peg.

 

Same interview he felt putting wieght on the bars until turn in helped him stop faster too.

 

Also on acceleration he used ouside peg pressure to stabilize the bike with a bit of extra traction, and inside peg pressure to reduce traction as desired to help steer. That made me smile as a couple took me to task in the distant past for thinking the same thing of peg pressures.

 

The magazine tried the foot thing and didn't feel they got much braking aid.

 

Wayne Rainey and Mick Doohan had some comments to go with Rossi's. Short, nice read. :)

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That boy Rossi, what a big Joker he is!

 

He can say whatever he likes about this and that, and it doesn't have to be even remotely true in anyway, shape or form. He knows other riders will hear or read about it, and go and try it, exactly because they want what he has, and what he can do.

 

I wouldn't pay much attention to what he openly says in the press about this, less we not forget he's the master of mind play, and he must walk away from some of these interviews thinking to himself, "that'll mess them about for a little while".... :lol:

 

Bullet

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The one thing about this foot off the peg technique, if you can even call it a technique is that rossi seems to be getting the credit for starting it! The commentators here in the UK have even started calling it the doctors dangle, but if you watch the moto gp movie Faster you will see that in the last year of the 2-stroke 500s John Hopkins was doing this exact thing on the 500 Suzuki while trying to compete with the 990s, Hopper had a good year that year considering the machinery he was up against and quite possibly no one raced as hard and on the edge as he did that year!

Also If you watch the races from this year, Rossi vs Lorenzo you will see that Lorenzo enters corners with a more conventional riding style of foot on the peg, another interesting point on Lorenzo's style is that he is one of the few moto gp racers that uses a type of stomp grip since as he says the most important thing about cornering a bike at such high speeds is getting securely locked onto the bike, sound familiar!

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That boy Rossi, what a big Joker he is!

 

He can say whatever he likes about this and that, and it doesn't have to be even remotely true in anyway, shape or form. He knows other riders will hear or read about it, and go and try it, exactly because they want what he has, and what he can do.

 

I wouldn't pay much attention to what he openly says in the press about this, less we not forget he's the master of mind play, and he must walk away from some of these interviews thinking to himself, "that'll mess them about for a little while".... :lol:

 

Bullet

 

I completely agree on this point-LOLOLOLOL

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I have been pondering this one for a while now. In watching a slow motion of Stoner alot became clearer to me. I for the longest time didn't know how to put into words for others to understand just how the bike feels under very heavy braking. Scott Russell gave me the one I was looking for this season in one of Speed's broadcasts. He said "hinging". In watching Stoner in slow motion it was very clear that he was using the leg out to balance that hinging motion of the rear wheel at the steering pivot point. He was also very clearly not using his knees to brace against the braking forces. He was actually using the leg out not only for correcting for the hinging effect but also moving it back as he went to keep his body weight more over the rear of the bike. It was absolutelly a thing of beauty to watch him do this in slow motion. When you think about it for the most part we have all agreed that locking in on the tank with the knees is the way to go for obvious reasons. One of them mainly is to avoid bar pressure that would start the hinging process. However if you could lock on the bike with one leg and use the other as ballast to keep your weight rearward you are effectivly moving that locked in position more towards the rear of the bike which obviously enables one to brake harder and later.I beleive that some riders have found this method helpfull weather they know why or not really doesn't matter it obviously works. Hmm fastest guys on the planet? I'm betting if their doing it...it probably works. In my opinion Casey has taken a good thing and refined it to the max!! Inovative riding techniques are a glorious thing to see evolve. Never the less being that I am not a motorcycle racing legend. I'm thinking when I get back on the track I will be locking into that gastank and doing everything I can to keep everything balanced and tidy before my TP.

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On why Rossi sticks his leg out...

If you pick up a copy of Roadracing World Sept.2009 issue, there is an interveiw/article, Valentino Rossi On Cornering p.15

"Phase 1: Braking and Entry"

"Before I start braking I move off the seat to the inside, so for Coppice you brake with the body to the right. You move early so you only have to make one movement to get the bike into the corner, also so the bike doesn't move around. Sometimes now I take the foot off the inside footpeg because it feels like I can brake harder."

 

Hope this answers the ongoing debate...

BCNU

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Not to sound conceited at all but I do this all the time! I haven't done it much on a motorcycle because I've rarely braked that over-the-top hard but it does help. I do it all the time in my gravel driveway on my mountain bike. I've found that it does help with balance under hard braking. If you are braking hard and setting up for a left-hander you don't want the bike to veer at all to the right so you throw your leg out to act as a ballast. If the rear starts to move right you can hang your foot off further, if your foot is close to the bike you can brake harder and throw your leg out to counter-act it. It helps for right handers too but usually on a motorcycle you are using the rear brake with your right foot to do a few extra percent of braking.

 

I have a feeling that Rossi doesn't have too many SRs and the fact that he selectively does it and brakes measurably harder in my mind means that the hard braking is a result of the leg out rather than the other way around. Anyway, that's my two cents.

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Not to sound conceited at all but I do this all the time! I haven't done it much on a motorcycle because I've rarely braked that over-the-top hard but it does help. I do it all the time in my gravel driveway on my mountain bike. I've found that it does help with balance under hard braking. If you are braking hard and setting up for a left-hander you don't want the bike to veer at all to the right so you throw your leg out to act as a ballast. If the rear starts to move right you can hang your foot off further, if your foot is close to the bike you can brake harder and throw your leg out to counter-act it. It helps for right handers too but usually on a motorcycle you are using the rear brake with your right foot to do a few extra percent of braking.

 

I have a feeling that Rossi doesn't have too many SRs and the fact that he selectively does it and brakes measurably harder in my mind means that the hard braking is a result of the leg out rather than the other way around. Anyway, that's my two cents.

 

How much does a leg weigh I sit here wondering....? 12-15Kgs.....(pure guess by the way)... So we're debating whether a flaping, unstable 12-15kg weight moved forward offsets the 145kg motorbike(for a motogp bike, plus the 65Kg rider (total 210kg)...? So thats what, 5% of the weight of the bike moved inwardd a little bit, I'm finding the physics super hard to compute as to the benefit, honestly (A fully fuelled bike like an 09 R1 is 210kgs, so must have even less benefit as the percentage is even smaller). Maybe on MTB, where the mass is much reduced, but on Motorbike, I reckon you'd struggle to feel it doing anything apart from keep yer wedding tackle a little cooler in the wind. :lol:

 

I still believe this started out of a bad habit, and its just become the norm, but when you see someone like Lorenzo who doesn't do it, pretty much the same speed as Rossi,

 

Bullet

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True, the numbers are very small but I still believe that it's for added feel under extreme braking. If you had a see-saw that had 1000kg on one side and 998kg on the other side regardless of how much the total weight was that 2kg WILL make a difference. When stuck out to the side the leg has quite a bit of leverage on the bike. Give it a shot on a mountain bike, if it's noticeable on that (which it certainly is) then wouldn't the best of the best be able to use it as an aid, as tiny as it may be?

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True, the numbers are very small but I still believe that it's for added feel under extreme braking. If you had a see-saw that had 1000kg on one side and 998kg on the other side regardless of how much the total weight was that 2kg WILL make a difference. When stuck out to the side the leg has quite a bit of leverage on the bike. Give it a shot on a mountain bike, if it's noticeable on that (which it certainly is) then wouldn't the best of the best be able to use it as an aid, as tiny as it may be?

 

I actually thought more about this is the PM, and I reckon the numbers are even smaller than I first put up... Coz if you really, really think about it, most riders put their legs out to the inside of the bike already, so we're in affect talking about knee down here, from the knee to the end of your foot, move out on forward. So lets say, maybe 5Kgs maximum.... I just think it's all in the mind.....

 

I think my personal problem with trying in the first instance is that I use my legs to brace myself and the body weight transfer forwards in the braking zone to keep my weight back on the bike. I only let my leg out right at the end of the braking transition. To change, I'd just slide foward, which cause me all sorts of other problems I'm afraid.

 

I do believe if people think it's making a difference, they should do it, and continue with it, but I need the facts and figures, and it would need to fit in with my riding style, (just as rear braking doesn't feature in my riding either on track), and it doesn't.

 

Bullet

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Wonder what riders will be saying about this in, say 5-10 years? Will it become normal, or go the way of the thumb rear brake, and backing it in?

 

CF

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Wonder what riders will be saying about this in, say 5-10 years? Will it become normal, or go the way of the thumb rear brake, and backing it in?

 

CF

 

I'd like to try a thumb brake, no idea if it would help, but I'd like to try one just to tick it off my list. Can't see it adding much in the hard braking zone when I'm fully on it, as the rear bobs just on the surface anyway, and would doubtful give much retardation. Might help on hard acceleration over some of the numpy tracks in the UK? Anyone used one..?

 

Bullet

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