Sense Of Traction

[Jaybird180]

How good do you rate your own sense of traction, and for this thread, let's look at corerning traction (as opposed to just acceleration or stopping traction).

 

Can you tell where you are with the traction in different situations? Do you get nervous, or feel pretty confident with your sense of this?

 

Good artilce on Bands of Traction by KC in his corner, if you'd like to check that out.

C

I hope this is not too far OT, but I had this topic in mind as I was doing this in my car yesterday in the wet.

 

I can confidently get the rear end to come around in the turns. I can also continuously feed power in sweepers until I get right on the edge of traction. It will get just out of line enough that I know it, but my passenger doesn't even know I'm playing this game, unless I hit a bump or slick spot and it goes, and then the electronic gadgetry takes over and limits my fun. I'd love to be this good (brave) on my bike.

 

I figure:

The typical car is about 2,500 lbs and has a rear traction footprint about 2.5X the size of a bike leaned over (2 wide tires vs 1). The way I figure, due to the weight and power, the motorcycle pilot should have more sensitivity and better control of traction. So how does one increase traction confidence?

 

Is your car rear wheel drive? mine is front wheel drive so no good for drifting!

I think that the first step to increasing traction confidence on a bike is recognising all of the SRs, especially #1 and #2 and be confident that when the bike breaks traction you will not, no matter what give in to these SRs! Both these SRs will put you and your bike into a potential crash situation so by understanding the effects of SR #1 and #2 and being able to ride through the slide without giving in to them would, should increase traction confidence!

Do you agree?

Yes, my car is RWD. I can see how SR 1 & 2 can be a barrier (LOLOLOLOL).

[acebobby]

How good do you rate your own sense of traction, and for this thread, let's look at corerning traction (as opposed to just acceleration or stopping traction).

 

Can you tell where you are with the traction in different situations? Do you get nervous, or feel pretty confident with your sense of this?

 

Good artilce on Bands of Traction by KC in his corner, if you'd like to check that out.

C

I hope this is not too far OT, but I had this topic in mind as I was doing this in my car yesterday in the wet.

 

I can confidently get the rear end to come around in the turns. I can also continuously feed power in sweepers until I get right on the edge of traction. It will get just out of line enough that I know it, but my passenger doesn't even know I'm playing this game, unless I hit a bump or slick spot and it goes, and then the electronic gadgetry takes over and limits my fun. I'd love to be this good (brave) on my bike.

 

I figure:

The typical car is about 2,500 lbs and has a rear traction footprint about 2.5X the size of a bike leaned over (2 wide tires vs 1). The way I figure, due to the weight and power, the motorcycle pilot should have more sensitivity and better control of traction. So how does one increase traction confidence?

 

Is your car rear wheel drive? mine is front wheel drive so no good for drifting!

I think that the first step to increasing traction confidence on a bike is recognising all of the SRs, especially #1 and #2 and be confident that when the bike breaks traction you will not, no matter what give in to these SRs! Both these SRs will put you and your bike into a potential crash situation so by understanding the effects of SR #1 and #2 and being able to ride through the slide without giving in to them would, should increase traction confidence!

Do you agree?

Yes, my car is RWD. I can see how SR 1 & 2 can be a barrier (LOLOLOLOL).

 

Hi Jay, I replied to your post regarding increasing traction confidence as like you this is something I am interested in achieving, I'm a bit confused about your reply! I only suggested overcoming SR 1 and 2 as a first step to increasing confidence. I realise there is alot more to sliding a bike than keeping your SRs in check, I know some people say that when the slide begins they hold the throttle in that position until it regains traction, some racers say if in doubt pin it! I guess that where the slide happens determines how easy it would be to control! e.g if it begins to slide after the apex it's quite easy to control! If it happens at the apex it would be a bit harder and takes a fair bit of skill and attention to control! If it breaks traction before the apex, thats one for the experts!

[Jaybird180]

Hi Jay, I replied to your post regarding increasing traction confidence as like you this is something I am interested in achieving, I'm a bit confused about your reply! I only suggested overcoming SR 1 and 2 as a first step to increasing confidence. I realise there is alot more to sliding a bike than keeping your SRs in check, I know some people say that when the slide begins they hold the throttle in that position until it regains traction, some racers say if in doubt pin it! I guess that where the slide happens determines how easy it would be to control! e.g if it begins to slide after the apex it's quite easy to control! If it happens at the apex it would be a bit harder and takes a fair bit of skill and attention to control! If it breaks traction before the apex, thats one for the experts!

 

Didn't intend any confusion. I was laughing with you, not at you.

 

I've managed to save a few rear slides. Mine were sudden grip losses on the rear on the left side at slow speed (I've had 2, perhaps 3 lifetime). All of them had this pattern. All of them saved. So my experience is suspect at best.

[acebobby]

Hi Jay, I replied to your post regarding increasing traction confidence as like you this is something I am interested in achieving, I'm a bit confused about your reply! I only suggested overcoming SR 1 and 2 as a first step to increasing confidence. I realise there is alot more to sliding a bike than keeping your SRs in check, I know some people say that when the slide begins they hold the throttle in that position until it regains traction, some racers say if in doubt pin it! I guess that where the slide happens determines how easy it would be to control! e.g if it begins to slide after the apex it's quite easy to control! If it happens at the apex it would be a bit harder and takes a fair bit of skill and attention to control! If it breaks traction before the apex, thats one for the experts!

 

Didn't intend any confusion. I was laughing with you, not at you.

 

I've managed to save a few rear slides. Mine were sudden grip losses on the rear on the left side at slow speed (I've had 2, perhaps 3 lifetime). All of them had this pattern. All of them saved. So my experience is suspect at best.

 

I've had a few like that now while leaned over quite far, not so much at slow speed though but it seems so unexpected and the rear snaps back into line quickly, not what I imagine when I hear people talking of a controllable slide!

[Cobie Fair]

Ideally one finds the limit a small piece at a time. Now and again you hear stuff like, "you never know how fast you can go until you crash." Lunacy.

 

If you come up on the edge of traction gradually, it won't be a big surprise.

 

If a rider could increase his speed a 1/1000 of a mile an hour at a time, do you think he'd get some gentle warning about a slide?

 

But having the correct data on how to handle a slide, and then training that in, in, in--that can take some doing. Trainable, doable, but can take a bit of work.

[jmccready]

Cobie,

Your question reminds me of an interview with MotoGP racer Gary McCoy on the FASTER documentary. He was well known for smokin' the rear on turn exit.If I recall correctly he described traction confidence as the ability to let it spin up a little, and then just playing with it, moderating the throttle.

 

As an ex-flattracker from my younger days, I think being confident with wheel spin can only be acheived by experience. It's easiesr to say than do, but we've just got to let it spin on corner exit, and gradually build our confidence.I know it's a lot easier to spin-em up in the dirt, and gain personal skill and control there, considering the cost of novice mistakes, learned the hard way, on the asphalt. Confidence. Experience.

 

my opinion,

john

[jmccready]

Cobie,

Your question reminds me of an interview with MotoGP racer Gary McCoy on the FASTER documentary. He was well known for smokin' the rear on turn exit. If I recall correctly he described traction confidence as the ability to let it spin up a little, and then just playing with it, moderating the throttle.

 

As an ex-flattracker from my younger days, I think being confident with wheel spin can only be acheived by experience. It's easiesr to say than do, but we've just got to let it spin on corner exit, and gradually build our confidence.I know it's a lot easier to spin-em up in the dirt, and gain personal skill and control there, considering the cost of novice mistakes, learned the hard way, on the asphalt. Confidence. Experience.

 

my opinion,

john

[Kevin Kane]

As an ex-flattracker from my younger days, I think being confident with wheel spin can only be acheived by experience. It's easiesr to say than do, but we've just got to let it spin on corner exit, and gradually build our confidence.I know it's a lot easier to spin-em up in the dirt, and gain personal skill and control there, considering the cost of novice mistakes, learned the hard way, on the asphalt. Confidence. Experience.

John;

The School's slide bike is a great way to gain some rear tire sliding experience in a (relatively) controlled environment. It really does slide but it usually takes some "coaching" to get students to light it up. It it does help build your confidence when you can find the traction limit and just push it beyond and actually get it to step out.

 

Kevin

[jmccready]

As an ex-flattracker from my younger days, I think being confident with wheel spin can only be acheived by experience. It's easiesr to say than do, but we've just got to let it spin on corner exit, and gradually build our confidence.I know it's a lot easier to spin-em up in the dirt, and gain personal skill and control there, considering the cost of novice mistakes, learned the hard way, on the asphalt. Confidence. Experience.

John;

The School's slide bike is a great way to gain some rear tire sliding experience in a (relatively) controlled environment. It really does slide but it usually takes some "coaching" to get students to light it up. It it does help build your confidence when you can find the traction limit and just push it beyond and actually get it to step out.

 

Kevin

 

 

Kevin,

I've seen photos on the website of the School's slide bike. That sure looks like fun! My first guess is that it'll take a good amount of courage and control to put that bike through it's paces. I'm anxious to get down to Cal. and give it a go. I'm gonna make every effort to get down to CSS this year.

 

Regards, John

[radix]

Hi All,

 

Not sure if this is the correct thread, but it certainly involves my (lack of) sense of traction....

 

I have done Level 1 at Silverstone Stowe - and going to Jerez in a couple of weeks time.

Since my course, I have been working on three things mainly, throttle control, picking a turn point and the two step.

I have also been trying to pick as deep a turn in point as possible.

 

I have found that in some corners - the nice wide ones with lots of room for error, strangely enough, I have no problems and can apply pretty good throttle control, in fact it is almost automatic to role the wrist when the bike isn't upright, am very relaxed on the bike and it goes just where I want it to - it all feels great.

 

I am talking about the roads here, so I am not exactly pushing it.

 

However, when the road is narrow (I live out in the countryside with very twisty, bumpy and narrow roads), with a wall next to it and I can't easily see the line I want to take all the way through the corner, everything goes to ######. It is also worse on right hand bends (in the UK, so riding on the left).

 

Having thought about it, a lot, I think that it is because I am basically not confident in my ability to get the bike turned, on the line I want and be confident that I will get traction. If I am going deep into the corner, then I am necessarily turning close to either the edge of the road (a stone wall), or the other lane. I have never had a loss of traction of the back wheel and have no idea what it feels like. So in a situation where I have to be very accurate with my turn input and confident that I will get traction, I find that I tense on the bars and my throttle control is... well, I have no throttle control, coasting. This compounds the whole situation, but I can't seem to do what I know will make it better.

 

The way I see it, the deeper I go into the corner, the less space I have before hitting another car or running off the road in which to make my correct turn input that will 1) keep me upright and 2) put me on the correct line and not run wide. So I end up going into corners waaaaaay too slow, making multiple turn inputs and then basically breaking every rule that I have been taught, caused by the uncertainty.

 

So, can anybody help me to overcome this problem? I have a sneaky feeling that in these situations, the issue may well be to do with where I am looking, but I also know that I have no real sense of traction, don't know where it will not grip anymore, what to do if this happens and am not confident in my ability to accurately turn the bike.

 

Danny

[Jaybird180]

Hi All,

 

Not sure if this is the correct thread, but it certainly involves my (lack of) sense of traction....

 

 

Danny

 

Hi Danny,

I suspect that your issue has nothing to do with traction at all. One of the things about vision skills is that we are learning to look at where we want to go, but part of it is filtering out extraneous information; in your case, the wall.

[Kevin Kane]

Hi All,

 

Not sure if this is the correct thread, but it certainly involves my (lack of) sense of traction....

 

I have done Level 1 at Silverstone Stowe - and going to Jerez in a couple of weeks time.

Since my course, I have been working on three things mainly, throttle control, picking a turn point and the two step.

I have also been trying to pick as deep a turn in point as possible.

 

I have found that in some corners - the nice wide ones with lots of room for error, strangely enough, I have no problems and can apply pretty good throttle control, in fact it is almost automatic to role the wrist when the bike isn't upright, am very relaxed on the bike and it goes just where I want it to - it all feels great.

 

I am talking about the roads here, so I am not exactly pushing it.

 

However, when the road is narrow (I live out in the countryside with very twisty, bumpy and narrow roads), with a wall next to it and I can't easily see the line I want to take all the way through the corner, everything goes to ######. It is also worse on right hand bends (in the UK, so riding on the left).

 

Having thought about it, a lot, I think that it is because I am basically not confident in my ability to get the bike turned, on the line I want and be confident that I will get traction. If I am going deep into the corner, then I am necessarily turning close to either the edge of the road (a stone wall), or the other lane. I have never had a loss of traction of the back wheel and have no idea what it feels like. So in a situation where I have to be very accurate with my turn input and confident that I will get traction, I find that I tense on the bars and my throttle control is... well, I have no throttle control, coasting. This compounds the whole situation, but I can't seem to do what I know will make it better.

 

The way I see it, the deeper I go into the corner, the less space I have before hitting another car or running off the road in which to make my correct turn input that will 1) keep me upright and 2) put me on the correct line and not run wide. So I end up going into corners waaaaaay too slow, making multiple turn inputs and then basically breaking every rule that I have been taught, caused by the uncertainty.

 

So, can anybody help me to overcome this problem? I have a sneaky feeling that in these situations, the issue may well be to do with where I am looking, but I also know that I have no real sense of traction, don't know where it will not grip anymore, what to do if this happens and am not confident in my ability to accurately turn the bike.

 

Danny

Danny;

Couple of thoughts: Do you practice the wide view when you are approaching the corner? It sounds a little like you might be target fixing and diminishing your cone of vision which will amp up your Survival Reactions pretty quickly. Once your SR's are dictating how you ride, you do throw all of what you have been taught right out the window. Tunnel vision will have your eyes darting around trying to find where you should be on the road as well as where you want to be going and the net result is that you have used up all of your 10 dollars worth of attention and you still need some to brake, shift, set your body position, your throttle and lean angle.

Maybe if you lowered your overall pace and concentrate on what you have been taught you can gradually bring your training back into alignment with your riding skills and allow yourself to enjoy cornering again.

 

FWIW, the more training I get and the more time I spend on the track the more tense I get on public roads - so you're not alone in that arena.

 

Kevin

[radix]

Hi,

 

Thanks for that guys. I do think that it is most likely the vision thing. So this isn't about traction at all.....

 

 

I will work harder at the vision drills, and look forward to doing Level 2 in a couple of days time....

 

Thanks

 

Danny

[Cobie Fair]

Hi,

 

Thanks for that guys. I do think that it is most likely the vision thing. So this isn't about traction at all.....

 

 

I will work harder at the vision drills, and look forward to doing Level 2 in a couple of days time....

 

Thanks

 

Danny

 

Danny,

 

Level 2 will work you over on the vision stuff, you'll see (pathetic pun?)

[kawdude636]

well said...

[Jaybird180]

Hi All,

 

Not sure if this is the correct thread, but it certainly involves my (lack of) sense of traction....

 

 

Danny

 

Hi Danny,

I suspect that your issue has nothing to do with traction at all. One of the things about vision skills is that we are learning to look at where we want to go, but part of it is filtering out extraneous information; in your case, the wall.

 

LOL...it's funny looking at my advice to you. Knowing is not the same as KNOWING something. Case in point: this weekend I found myself looking at the stupid berm in T4 at The Streets. (doh)

[Cobie Fair]

Hi All,

 

Not sure if this is the correct thread, but it certainly involves my (lack of) sense of traction....

 

 

Danny

 

Hi Danny,

I suspect that your issue has nothing to do with traction at all. One of the things about vision skills is that we are learning to look at where we want to go, but part of it is filtering out extraneous information; in your case, the wall.

 

LOL...it's funny looking at my advice to you. Knowing is not the same as KNOWING something. Case in point: this weekend I found myself looking at the stupid berm in T4 at The Streets. (doh)

 

The Visual skills are huge, no doubt about that.

 

C

[Jaybird180]

How good do you rate your own sense of traction, and for this thread, let's look at corerning traction (as opposed to just acceleration or stopping traction).

 

Can you tell where you are with the traction in different situations? Do you get nervous, or feel pretty confident with your sense of this?

 

Good artilce on Bands of Traction by KC in his corner, if you'd like to check that out.

C

 

I posted this in the wrong section so here it is again:

 

Mr Code has made statements about the marvels of radial tire technology in this article and other places as well. I've read as much as I can to try and understand why, but I have no "real" frame of reference; I've only ridden on "modern" radial tires...and most of the internet articles are about car tires (go figure).

 

I've heard horror stories about this tire is ###### or that tire is garbage that it makes me hesitant. Others who have heard similar stories may feel the same way . On a subconscious level, I've bought the stories and a different brand of tire to match.

 

Is it just as simple as improving the rider's technique to allow him better perception of the specific tire he is riding on? How does one get to such a level if he distrusts the rubber he is practicing on? Take for example the typical track-day tire on the first morning session: does the tire talk to the rider in a discernible fashion as if to say "I'm ready to be ridden"?

 

I hope I'm making some sense here...

[Cobie Fair]

I posted this in the wrong section so here it is again:

 

Mr Code has made statements about the marvels of radial tire technology in this article and other places as well. I've read as much as I can to try and understand why, but I have no "real" frame of reference; I've only ridden on "modern" radial tires...and most of the internet articles are about car tires (go figure).

 

I've heard horror stories about this tire is ###### or that tire is garbage that it makes me hesitant. Others who have heard similar stories may feel the same way . On a subconscious level, I've bought the stories and a different brand of tire to match.

 

Is it just as simple as improving the rider's technique to allow him better perception of the specific tire he is riding on? How does one get to such a level if he distrusts the rubber he is practicing on? Take for example the typical track-day tire on the first morning session: does the tire talk to the rider in a discernible fashion as if to say "I'm ready to be ridden"?

 

I hope I'm making some sense here...

 

If a rider has good throttle control, and doesn't add lean angle and throttle at the same time, he won't get surprised. He'll also (or she) find the limits of that tire, warm or cold, better or worse than some other tire, whatever it is.

 

Street tires of today would have won races of some years ago (Keith has written about that).

 

Sometimes you have to take a look at who is writing/giving a tire opinion. Fast racer, griping cause it's not as grippy as a "real" race tire--but he's still within 2-3 seconds of his best lap time?

 

C

[Jaybird180]

I posted this in the wrong section so here it is again:

 

Mr Code has made statements about the marvels of radial tire technology in this article and other places as well. I've read as much as I can to try and understand why, but I have no "real" frame of reference; I've only ridden on "modern" radial tires...and most of the internet articles are about car tires (go figure).

 

I've heard horror stories about this tire is ###### or that tire is garbage that it makes me hesitant. Others who have heard similar stories may feel the same way . On a subconscious level, I've bought the stories and a different brand of tire to match.

 

Is it just as simple as improving the rider's technique to allow him better perception of the specific tire he is riding on? How does one get to such a level if he distrusts the rubber he is practicing on? Take for example the typical track-day tire on the first morning session: does the tire talk to the rider in a discernible fashion as if to say "I'm ready to be ridden"?

 

I hope I'm making some sense here...

 

If a rider has good throttle control, and doesn't add lean angle and throttle at the same time, he won't get surprised. He'll also (or she) find the limits of that tire, warm or cold, better or worse than some other tire, whatever it is.

 

Street tires of today would have won races of some years ago (Keith has written about that).

 

Sometimes you have to take a look at who is writing/giving a tire opinion. Fast racer, griping cause it's not as grippy as a "real" race tire--but he's still within 2-3 seconds of his best lap time?

 

C

 

So with better throttle control, I can feel the limits of the tire? How do you recommend dealing with the confidence issues?

 

For example:

 

I went out a few nights ago and metup at the hangout. We sat around for awhile and then all departed. Knowing it was cold out, I took it easy as one of the guys blasted by me. At the light, I cautioned him about the tarmac/tire/ambient temperature. His reply was, "I don't worry about that, I'm on ****" (same brand tire I'm on, different compound). Light turns green and away he went, hanging off around the tight DR turn, while I meandered about my cold tires.

 

What does he know that I need to find out? Or is it the other way 'round?

[jmccready]

I posted this in the wrong section so here it is again:

 

Mr Code has made statements about the marvels of radial tire technology in this article and other places as well. I've read as much as I can to try and understand why, but I have no "real" frame of reference; I've only ridden on "modern" radial tires...and most of the internet articles are about car tires (go figure).

 

I've heard horror stories about this tire is ###### or that tire is garbage that it makes me hesitant. Others who have heard similar stories may feel the same way . On a subconscious level, I've bought the stories and a different brand of tire to match.

 

Is it just as simple as improving the rider's technique to allow him better perception of the specific tire he is riding on? How does one get to such a level if he distrusts the rubber he is practicing on? Take for example the typical track-day tire on the first morning session: does the tire talk to the rider in a discernible fashion as if to say "I'm ready to be ridden"?

 

I hope I'm making some sense here...

 

If a rider has good throttle control, and doesn't add lean angle and throttle at the same time, he won't get surprised. He'll also (or she) find the limits of that tire, warm or cold, better or worse than some other tire, whatever it is.

 

Street tires of today would have won races of some years ago (Keith has written about that).

 

Sometimes you have to take a look at who is writing/giving a tire opinion. Fast racer, griping cause it's not as grippy as a "real" race tire--but he's still within 2-3 seconds of his best lap time?

 

C

 

So with better throttle control, I can feel the limits of the tire? How do you recommend dealing with the confidence issues?

 

For example:

 

I went out a few nights ago and metup at the hangout. We sat around for awhile and then all departed. Knowing it was cold out, I took it easy as one of the guys blasted by me. At the light, I cautioned him about the tarmac/tire/ambient temperature. His reply was, "I don't worry about that, I'm on ****" (same brand tire I'm on, different compound). Light turns green and away he went, hanging off around the tight DR turn, while I meandered about my cold tires.

 

What does he know that I need to find out? Or is it the other way 'round?

 

JB,

 

So what's he know that you need to find out?........ Maybe he knows that specific ***** tire's threshold or grip, when the tires IS cold, and he is confident that the tire will hold, consistently, up to or close to that point.

That certainly would be a confidence booster in my book .

 

Do you know of said threshold?

 

I believe we gain confidence thru personal, specific experiences that either reinforce our TRUST of grip........ or distrust of tires and equipment that are inconsistent, and difficult to "read".

 

I'm not saying ride with no regard to safety, I'm saying SNEAK UP on it. Find the range of grip, at various temps.

 

A mans gotta know his limitations ( and his tire's limitations, literally). Those limitations are different for all of us, in different situations where our individual strengths or weaknesses show thru. Are you more confident with your tires at certain temps?

 

I don't believe in "throwing caution to the wind", but I do believe in pushing oneself, in measurable ways, to achieve a deeper understanding of the true ability of our eqiupment. Do you agree?

[Kevin Kane]

AB;

Great post!

 

K

[Jaybird180]

I posted this in the wrong section so here it is again:

 

Mr Code has made statements about the marvels of radial tire technology in this article and other places as well. I've read as much as I can to try and understand why, but I have no "real" frame of reference; I've only ridden on "modern" radial tires...and most of the internet articles are about car tires (go figure).

 

I've heard horror stories about this tire is ###### or that tire is garbage that it makes me hesitant. Others who have heard similar stories may feel the same way . On a subconscious level, I've bought the stories and a different brand of tire to match.

 

Is it just as simple as improving the rider's technique to allow him better perception of the specific tire he is riding on? How does one get to such a level if he distrusts the rubber he is practicing on? Take for example the typical track-day tire on the first morning session: does the tire talk to the rider in a discernible fashion as if to say "I'm ready to be ridden"?

 

I hope I'm making some sense here...

 

If a rider has good throttle control, and doesn't add lean angle and throttle at the same time, he won't get surprised. He'll also (or she) find the limits of that tire, warm or cold, better or worse than some other tire, whatever it is.

 

Street tires of today would have won races of some years ago (Keith has written about that).

 

Sometimes you have to take a look at who is writing/giving a tire opinion. Fast racer, griping cause it's not as grippy as a "real" race tire--but he's still within 2-3 seconds of his best lap time?

 

C

 

So with better throttle control, I can feel the limits of the tire? How do you recommend dealing with the confidence issues?

 

For example:

 

I went out a few nights ago and metup at the hangout. We sat around for awhile and then all departed. Knowing it was cold out, I took it easy as one of the guys blasted by me. At the light, I cautioned him about the tarmac/tire/ambient temperature. His reply was, "I don't worry about that, I'm on ****" (same brand tire I'm on, different compound). Light turns green and away he went, hanging off around the tight DR turn, while I meandered about my cold tires.

 

What does he know that I need to find out? Or is it the other way 'round?

 

JB,

 

So what's he know that you need to find out?........ Maybe he knows that specific ***** tire's threshold or grip, when the tires IS cold, and he is confident that the tire will hold, consistently, up to or close to that point.

That certainly would be a confidence booster in my book .

 

Do you know of said threshold?

 

I believe we gain confidence thru personal, specific experiences that either reinforce our TRUST of grip........ or distrust of tires and equipment that are inconsistent, and difficult to "read".

 

I'm not saying ride with no regard to safety, I'm saying SNEAK UP on it. Find the range of grip, at various temps.

 

A mans gotta know his limitations ( and his tire's limitations, literally). Those limitations are different for all of us, in different situations where our individual strengths or weaknesses show thru. Are you more confident with your tires at certain temps?

 

I don't believe in "throwing caution to the wind", but I do believe in pushing oneself, in measurable ways, to achieve a deeper understanding of the true ability of our eqiupment. Do you agree?

 

Makes sense.

 

About my other question: Do tires give discernible feedback when they're ready? I "think" my front tire does this, but I've only felt it on track. It feels like it resists turning in and feels like it's rolling on the carcass. Then after a few corners this feeling goes away. I've taken it as a sign that it's ready. Am I going in the right direction?

[Cobie Fair]

 

Makes sense.

 

About my other question: Do tires give discernible feedback when they're ready? I "think" my front tire does this, but I've only felt it on track. It feels like it resists turning in and feels like it's rolling on the carcass. Then after a few corners this feeling goes away. I've taken it as a sign that it's ready. Am I going in the right direction?

 

If ones technique is good, there is lots of warning. Bands of Traction article gives a bit more on what to sense. With modern tires, warmed up fully, asphalt isn't slippery (dirt/oil, etc.), and not on the brakes at turn in, pretty amazing what they will do.