Help Me! Causes Of My Crash Video Attached

[Speedy66]

hi people,

 

was racing last weekend when i had a lost the front end. however i lost it after the apex. no brakes were applied. would love to find the cause. personally i think it was oil. so the marshalls wernt doing there job.

 

CRASH VIDEO CLICK HERE

[Speedy66]

 

 

[Bullet]

Hi Mate,

 

Sorry to hear/see your crash. I've reviewed your video, and I'd say you lost it before the Apex, and you were also on the gas and were very early. Have you read any of the the Twist of the wrist Books? From my observation, I'd say you weren't observing the throttle rule No.1. Question is, do you know what that is?

 

Bullet

[Speedy66]

no mate. havent read it

 

but i did loose it after the apex because i wasnt on the brakes. the crash was at knockhill with duffus dip. it doesnt look that steep on the camera but it is. there was a bike that blew up on that corner but there was no cement dust put down.

 

i was also running the same tyres i used at an open pit at cadwell park the week before. but i didnt feel any movement any were else on the track.

[Bullet]

no mate. havent read it

 

but i did loose it after the apex because i wasnt on the brakes. the crash was at knockhill with duffus dip. it doesnt look that steep on the camera but it is. there was a bike that blew up on that corner but there was no cement dust put down.

 

i was also running the same tyres i used at an open pit at cadwell park the week before. but i didnt feel any movement any were else on the track.

 

You could hear you weren't on the brakes pretty much all the way down the hill? I've ridden at Knockhill, I know of the corner. Did anyone else crash immediately after? In my experienced position, your crash doesn't look like surface issues, it looks like an incorrect application of the gas. You're rolling on the gas, and adding lean angle combined. (well that's how it seems from the video?) If you read the TW2, and or you'd attended the school, we'd be able to correct you of this error, but rider error it almost certainly is I'm afraid. Sorry.

 

Bullet

[Speedy66]

Right,

 

time for schooling. how much and were can i do it ??

 

 

i cant understand how you can lose the front whilst on the gas. i always thought to much gas will kick the backend out and to much front brake will push the push the front end causng a low slide. i never had a problem on that corner ever. however a few did come off on that same corner through the weekend.

 

if its any help it was fairly hot weather. but the tyres seemed very planted to the track. was using supercorsa's . i showed a few riders in the paddock after it happen they reckoned it was oil out of the blowen up fzr 400 that was on the track at the same time.

 

ps cheers for the help bullet. could with all help being a rookie racer

[Bullet]

Right,

 

time for schooling. how much and were can i do it ??

 

 

Hi Mate,

 

OK, school schedule can be found at http://www.superbikeschool.co.uk/schedule.php there are only 2 days left this year now, and i'm not sure of availability. Even if it's say's it's booked up, you could ring into the office and ask about it mate. You could also read TW2, it explains the rule well, but clearly practical application/correction of you riding your own bike is fundamental here too, as you have a bad habit.

 

To show you, you're not on your own my friend, (and you're not, I assure you), please also read this thread: http://forums.superb...?showtopic=2162

 

Bullet

[Speedy66]

Right,

 

time for schooling. how much and were can i do it ??

 

 

Hi Mate,

 

OK, school schedule can be found at http://www.superbike...uk/schedule.php there are only 2 days left this year now, and i'm not sure of availability. Even if it's say's it's booked up, you could ring into the office and ask about it mate. You could also read TW2, it explains the rule well, but clearly practical application/correction of you riding your own bike is fundamental here too, as you have a bad habit.

 

To show you, you're not on your own my friend, (and you're not, I assure you), please also read this thread: http://forums.superb...?showtopic=2162

 

Bullet

 

 

 

 

just read through that thread and most of the theorys are from the back giving way. wish i could afford to run that class at silverstone 379 quid is out of my budget for a club racer. maybe i'll plug my sponsors next year. are you one of coachs there ?

[Bullet]

Right,

 

time for schooling. how much and were can i do it ??

 

 

Hi Mate,

 

OK, school schedule can be found at http://www.superbike...uk/schedule.php there are only 2 days left this year now, and i'm not sure of availability. Even if it's say's it's booked up, you could ring into the office and ask about it mate. You could also read TW2, it explains the rule well, but clearly practical application/correction of you riding your own bike is fundamental here too, as you have a bad habit.

 

To show you, you're not on your own my friend, (and you're not, I assure you), please also read this thread: http://forums.superb...?showtopic=2162

 

Bullet

 

 

 

 

just read through that thread and most of the theorys are from the back giving way. wish i could afford to run that class at silverstone 379 quid is out of my budget for a club racer. maybe i'll plug my sponsors next year. are you one of coachs there ?

 

Hi mate,

 

Yeah, I think it's fair to say rear is most common but think through your scenario here? By your own admission a less than perfect tyre? An odd downhill off camber turn? You rolling on a lot of gas early in the turn. What else is going on with the bike? Are you loading or unloading the front? Result? Well, we've got it right there in pictures I'm afraid my friend.

 

I understand the course being a lot of cash, hence why the book is a start for sure. You can at least understand the reasons why in more depth, and understand how it should be done properly. Its covered in a lot of depth. Yeah, I'm one of the UK coaching staff. For my sins.

 

Hope this helped clear it up for ya mate.

 

Bullet

[Speedy66]

can i just run through that again im coming down the dip and i clip the apex and start accelerating out of the corner, my backend squats and my front unloads and loose the frontend. i would of throught applying more throttle in that corner would make the back come out.

 

can you help me clarify.

 

 

sorry to be dumb ass but im going back up there this weekend and i want to improve my riding ( hence that corner has kind of knocked my confidence) probs lost about second or two being to careful

 

 

[Speedy66]

just post these stills to demonstrate what i think happened.....

 

 

 

 

right this pic is hit the apex

 

 

then this next out is when you see the front wheel tuck

 

 

 

 

finally when the bike lets go

 

[Bullet]

can i just run through that again im coming down the dip and i clip the apex and start accelerating out of the corner, my backend squats and my front unloads and loose the frontend. i would of throught applying more throttle in that corner would make the back come out.

 

can you help me clarify.

 

 

sorry to be dumb ass but im going back up there this weekend and i want to improve my riding ( hence that corner has kind of knocked my confidence) probs lost about second or two being to careful

 

 

 

Watch your video again. Carefully listen to your gas. When did you crack it on? So the weight transfers to the back, does that load the rear tyre more or less? What about the front? What's going on there? More weight, or less? And more lean angle, that help or not?

 

B

[faffi]

 

 

just read through that thread and most of the theorys are from the back giving way. wish i could afford to run that class at silverstone 379 quid is out of my budget for a club racer. maybe i'll plug my sponsors next year. are you one of coachs there ?

 

Another way to look at it is how much will you save if the class helps you avoid a crash? What if it saves you a broken bone or two? Suddenly, it looks like a bargain

[Speedy66]

Watch your video again. Carefully listen to your gas. When did you crack it on? on the apex

 

 

 

So the weight transfers to the back, does that load the rear tyre more or less? more

 

 

What about the front? goes light

 

What's going on there? the backends getting pushed down and the front ends going light

 

More weight, or less?more weight on the back less on the front.

 

And more lean angle, that help or not? not really

 

 

am stuck now. sorry for being stupid but from them question i answered the out come should have been the backend coming out. however the front went and there was no weight there hmmmmmm.

[Bullet]

OK, so we're agreed then we've moved more of the weight of the bike to the rear. So, you get the back stepping out when you have more load on the tyre than it can take. You're only riding a 400, not something very powerful like a 1000. Had it been one of those, you'd probably have had the back come around, as you have more power than traction. When you crack the gas, the rear loads more, and we've agreed loading more weight to the rear than the front. You've then asked the tyre for more, with suspension that doesn't work well because you've leaned the bike over more. Essentially you've got less weight on the front, smaller contract patch rolling on more and more gas. the fronts going to even lighter, and voila. lowside.

 

Your issue is the result of incorrect application of the throttle. I'd also suggest you need to understand a lot more about how a motorbike works, how it goes around corners, and the Twist of the Wrist 2 book will give you this. You'll understand a lot more about how you give it what it needs from you.

 

Make sense?

 

Bullet

 

p.s. and to my ears, you rolled on way before the Apex as well. Does anyone else hear that?

[BLSJDS]

OK, so we're agreed then we've moved more of the weight of the bike to the rear. So, you get the back stepping out when you have more load on the tyre than it can take. You're only riding a 400, not something very powerful like a 1000. Had it been one of those, you'd probably have had the back come around, as you have more power than traction. When you crack the gas, the rear loads more, and we've agreed loading more weight to the rear than the front. You've then asked the tyre for more, with suspension that doesn't work well because you've leaned the bike over more. Essentially you've got less weight on the front, smaller contract patch rolling on more and more gas. the fronts going to even lighter, and voila. lowside.

 

Your issue is the result of incorrect application of the throttle. I'd also suggest you need to understand a lot more about how a motorbike works, how it goes around corners, and the Twist of the Wrist 2 book will give you this. You'll understand a lot more about how you give it what it needs from you.

 

Make sense?

 

Bullet

 

p.s. and to my ears, you rolled on way before the Apex as well. Does anyone else hear that?

 

It sounded that way to me. IMHO, the crash was a result of adding throttle AND lean angle, which I believe is a common cause based on what I've learned at CSS. Glad you are ok!