DUNLOP-RTS

With 1 rider going 15 seconds slower, tires and the bike being equal, the variable would be the RIDER. Its not the tire, not the bike, its the rider and his level of experience. I would highly question the slower riders interpretation of how he fell. If he claimed it was from grip, yet another rider is going 15 seconds faster and he did not fall, then it can't be from lack of grip, because the faster rider just proved there was plenty of grip. There are other factors in play that the rider cannot observe, but is attributing the problem to "Grip". maybe the tires were cold maybe he holds the handlebars to tight maybe he makes many steering changes mid corner maybe he chopped the throttle maybe he quickly opened the throttle maybe maybe maybe The rider was not able to determine what really happened, so he attributed the problem to "Grip". If he continues on this path he will always have the wrong reason he fell. He will always think it was becasue of the tires, when if fact he had some other riding issue. Many tire issues are really not issues, just a mis-observation of what is happening.

Hector, Yes we have use the N-Tec slicks and D211GP on the New BMW. With great success. We have many riders in the Eastern US that use the N-Tec and win races on a BMW. Is DTC traction control? If you are asking if traction control works with N-Tec, the answer is YES. Certainly it does. It should work with any tire. Have you tried it? DTC is traction control, and we have had all kinds of tires from, the Q-2's, to the slicks, to the GP-A's, works great on all. CF Thanks...Steve and Cobie, with those two answers Im pretty confident Im safe riding in those tires with DTC...there is a lot of confusion on this issue in other s1000rr related forums of the DTC firing before or after a slide with not the stock tires...but of those people have nothing near the experience of you two with those tires and bikes. So where do I sign? Need a pair of Ntec´s... Hector, Just because someone writes about it does not make it true. You must evaluate whether the person had the know how to write it. I would not look to forums with any Joe rider trying to answer questions about something like Traction Control and tires. I would look to someone that is actually riding the same model competitively on the racetrack. Thier observations will be more valid. Also look to yourself for the observations. You are the one riding the bike. Trust what you feel and observe. You should trust yourself and feel safe with your observations before you over-ride them with other peoples observations.

OK Steve; help us understand the distinctions if you will. On TV we are typically told the compounds of the front and rear tires different riders have selected but what are the factors that lead them to make their selections? I think I understand that a harder tire, especially the rear will last longer and provide grip later on at the expense of traction in the earlier laps but I'm not sure. Also, what would lead a rider or his crew chief to say soft v. medium v. hard? Does a rider ever choose a hard compound for a sprint race and is there a circumstance where they would choose a soft compound for an endurance race? Can you elaborate a bit here? TIA; Rainman RainMan, Great question! Picking Compounds: First off, its not possible to put everything into a small tight neat box and make solid rules like "hotter weather = harder tire" or " Smooth track = soft tire". If this was all true my job would be super easy. Tracks differ from one another. Track conditions can change from day to day or season to season. The tire performance and durability may also change as lap times change. At the top levels of racing, the words soft, med and hard are really just names. If you changed the names to tire A, B or C, the drill would still be the same. So taking a real world example: the rider tries tire B, then tire A, then tire C, giving feedback after each. The order does not matter for the purpose of this example. The riders feedback is most important here. Depending on the feedback, level of grip, consistency (did/did not drop off in performance), and a review of lap times, the team (rider and crew, but mostly the rider) would decide on which compound to select. This may seem simple, and it is a basic format. IF someone then said "but the track is rough, we need to go with a harder tire", would you make a switch if the durability of the chosen tire right in front of you looked good and the rider reported no issue with durability and his lap times were better? or if someone said" we need better lap times and the track is smooth, lets use a soft", would you switch if the tire you chose just ran the best lap time and the rider liked it the best? This procedure gets less important the slower the rider goes. For a track day rider going 15 seconds off the winning pace, his feedback for grip is invalid. At those lap times one cannot determine the level of grip, thus the feedback is not as usable. When factory riders, setting track records, can only notice about 0.5 seconds difference from one compound to the next, there is no way a rider going 5 seconds slower can tell the difference from one compound to the next. After we look at this we also have to note that harder tires do tend to last longer, yes this is true. but in a race situation (like you see on TV) the tires only need to last that race. Choices for track day riders would be based on other factors than the procedure above. Also softer tires sometimes will tear in colder conditions, so a harder tire in colder conditions might be a better choice for track days or even racing depending on the conditions and the compound. This may seem backwards from logical thinking, harder tires when cold, but it is workable. The main point here is there are no hard rules for compounds. Its whichever compound works. Track day riders can usually use any compound. The faster you go, the more the compound can make a difference. Asses the level of rider you are and make a tire choice based on that level. don't assume that Ben Spies tire choice will work well for you at your lap times or track conditions. It may or may not.

Hector, Yes we have use the N-Tec slicks and D211GP on the New BMW. With great success. We have many riders in the Eastern US that use the N-Tec and win races on a BMW. Is DTC traction control? If you are asking if traction control works with N-Tec, the answer is YES. Certainly it does. It should work with any tire. Have you tried it?

OK, so your used you hand to feel the tire. The test for grip is on the track. Feeling the tire with you hand or poking it with a fingernail to determine how "Sticky" the tire, is not a reliable way to test the tire. The true test is how well it works on the track/street. Your observation of the Q2 being better on the street than the Q, is a valid observation. your feeling of the performance of the tire goes in step with the majority of others that have tried it. IF one tire comes off the track and "Feels" to the hand stickier than another tire, that is not a guarantee or an indicator of how well it works on the track. The tire is a package of COMPOUND and CONSTRUCTION. How well they work together determines the performance level of the tire. Some tires are very soft compound, and thus they may "Feel" sticky, but in fact they may not give as good a grip on the racetrack. SOFT does not equal GRIP. If it was true, then we would only make SOFT tires. Or we would replace the names SOFT, MED and HARD, with GRIP, LESS GRIP, EVEN LESS GRIP. Trust what YOU feel on the track. That is the most important factor, what YOU feel. when I speak with riders about their tires, their statement of how the tire felt to them is the most important factor. There is no gauge or gadget that can replace the feedback.

When you store the tires, keep them away from electrical motors (like your freezer) or electrical devices. These electrical fields can emit ozone and other rubber depleting agents. Keep them from fertilizer, it too emits chemicals that deplete rubber. All to often a rider will park their bike next to the freezer or the bag of weed-and-feed in their garage over the winter, only to find the sidewall on one side weather cracked. Just park your bike on the other side of the garage, or remove these factors from the storage area. Putting the bike on a bike stand is a good idea, but not a must. The flat spot will round out when the tire us warmed up and rolled on. Certainly the tire will be contorting heavily when hot, the flat spot not do the same thing. Don't lose sleep over it. Your 2 year old rains are an issue if the tread cuts have lost their sharp edges from use. If the tire was new, you have no problem in a tire that is a couple of years old. Its how sharp the edges are that is the biggest factor in a rain tire being good or bad. Heat cycles: Dunlops are not very effected by heat cycles. Tires wear out, the rubber gets thinner and they lose grip from that action. Heat cycle is not something you need to be concerned with is you use Dunlops. The importance of this is like a glass of water to a swimming pool. Remember my words, because it going to come up a lot in future posts - "the rubber gets thinner and they lose grip from that action".

Dylan, Let me ask a question before I give an answer: When you say the tires felt sticky/tacky straight off the track, or don't feel as sticky coming off the straight off the track. are you saying you felt the tire with your hand/finger or some object? or are you saying the grip you felt while riding? I am trying to isolate the tool used to describe the tire. your hand or your butt on the seat?

Hector, We used the Qualifiers, Q-2. CF And Coches where on Ntecs? I ask this because there lot ob doubts about DTC running with Dunlop slicks in other froums, and where better than CSS to know for sure if they work fine with dtc...Guess all coaches run on slicks and slick mode....? Hector, Your questions seems to be: is the N-Tec Slick the same as the D211GP UK N-Tec but with a tread pattern? Yes and no. Let me be specific- Both the N-Tec slick and the D211GP N-Tec are the same CONSTRUCTION. In that respect they are the same. Being N-Tec, they are low pressure and Zero Growth. There is 1 rear N-Tec Slick, 195/65x17. This is exactly the same width and diameter as the D211GP N-Tec 200/55x17. Comparing those 2 rears they are basically the same, with the D211GP having a tread pattern. They both come in the same compounds. The 190/55x17 rear is 1mm smaller in width and 7mm smaller in diameter (3.5 in ride height) than the 195/65x17 slick. They are very close but not exactly the same. They both come in the same compounds. The 120/70x17 front is the same in width and diameter the 125/80x17 slick. the shape is slightly different but for most part they are the same. They both come in the same compounds. performance of the slick is slightly better then the D211GP. you can see the size and compound chart here: http://www.dunloprac...com/fitment.pdf

I think I can help you all out here with some solid facts and procedures. There are many urban legends regarding tire warmers. When the forum gets setup I will be happy to add my 2 cents worth and help you guys navigate this seemingly confusing issue, and turn it into a very simple one (which it really is simple). Would that be alright with you guys if I jump in?