Few Things Im Struggling With

[Mr Clauds]

Hey guys

 

Just a quick background:

Been riding since March (did some off roading when I was a kid though)

Read all books by Keith, Andy and then some others.

Did the CCS level 1 last Thursday and it truly made something in me click.

They were able to take everything I read and show me where and when to apply it properly...

Flash was a great instuctor and Andy imparted some knowledge that really resonated with me and made my confidence soar with just a few well placed words!

 

Here is where im still having a few problems and would like some guidance:

 

My current barriers that I want to work on:

Not knowing where me max lean angle really is.

Im hanging off with good body position (could put head over some more though) and have the knee down. I got a few cases of grinding the foot peg (still originals) or toes (im up on the ball of my foot). Usually that makes me pick it up a little as i panic that im going to dig in and unload the tyres and down i'll go.

 

Just how far further can you lean a bike when you're scrapping stock foot pegs? (on a 954)

 

This causes other set backs in that I enter corners a little slower; so as to not overjudge it which would have lead me to grinding it up (fear of picking up the tyres) to not run off, but then realise i'm stuck at lower speed and can't open throttle more than what the lean angle dictates.

 

Sense of speed:

The no brakes drills work great, but I have such limited time on the track and wanted to know if there is any other way to practice this off a bike?

 

No brakes while driving a car?

Playstation gaming with realistic sense of speed?

Driving in car and guessing exact speeds?

 

My sense of speed is around 8secs off on tracks around 4km long, 9 turns. As long as im comfortable.

As soon as I start pushing it, this deteriorates rather quickly.

 

Thanks for everything

[Jasonzilla]

I'm still trying to figure all that out as well. The one thing I'm working on is standardizing my BP, and from there I'll learn what the max lean is on my bike. If I need to, I'll get farther off the bike, and increase my max lean, but getting to that point is the tricky part. Different corners are going to affect how you enter, unless you're really that good, but again, practice practice practice.

 

If you're grinding the footpeg, getting farther off the bike will be what helps you. When I'm in a corner I go in with the goal of holding the bike up as far as I can. I adjust my BP to suit the bikes position. If you're grinding your foot, it's not tucked up enough. It could be that you're weighting the inside peg too much, and it's pushing your foot. I like pivot steering, but still think at the most you should have 50/50 weight distribution on the pegs.

 

I don't know how much work you can get in while driving. What I've found is fun is getting my head turned before I reach my turn point. That's just reinforcement though. Video games aren't affective unless it's familiarizing with a track (Spies), or having fun. You don't use the same motions while playing a game.

[Cobie Fair]

On most bikes, after you touch the footpeg, you don't want to go much further, as you will hit hard parts. Ideally on a track, you'd get your knee down before you touched a peg, and you can use that as a lean angle guage. Don't think the Brit school has many places they can run the lean bike (too bad), due to track restrictions. But for sure they can assist you at with your body position in a static setting (part of Level 2).

 

CF

[acebobby]

Would turning the bike quicker at your turn point not let you carry more speed with less lean angle?

[Jasonzilla]

Would turning the bike quicker at your turn point not let you carry more speed with less lean angle?

I'd think carrying more speed through a corner would require more lean angle regardless of how you turn it in.

[tweek]

Would turning the bike quicker at your turn point not let you carry more speed with less lean angle?

I'd think carrying more speed through a corner would require more lean angle regardless of how you turn it in.

 

 

Not quite.

 

It is like changing the steering ratio on a car. If your car takes 2.5 turns to go from max left to max right and you put in a gear that only takes 1.5 turns what happens? You come up to the turn point at the same speed and turn in the wheel to the same angle but quicker (b/c of the faster steering ratio) you'll find yourself running off the inside of the track.

 

Back on the bike, if you keep everything constant - speed, turn point, apex point and the line between and only change the speed that you get to max lean angle you'll end up riding off the track to the inside.

So now change the max lean angle (the amount you turn in) and you go around the turn w/o dragging a knee

Or

move the TP up

Or

Go faster

 

Of course putting all of this in to consistent practice is an entirely different matter.

[Bullet]

Would turning the bike quicker at your turn point not let you carry more speed with less lean angle?

I'd think carrying more speed through a corner would require more lean angle regardless of how you turn it in.

 

 

Not quite.

 

It is like changing the steering ratio on a car. If your car takes 2.5 turns to go from max left to max right and you put in a gear that only takes 1.5 turns what happens? You come up to the turn point at the same speed and turn in the wheel to the same angle but quicker (b/c of the faster steering ratio) you'll find yourself running off the inside of the track.

 

Back on the bike, if you keep everything constant - speed, turn point, apex point and the line between and only change the speed that you get to max lean angle you'll end up riding off the track to the inside.

So now change the max lean angle (the amount you turn in) and you go around the turn w/o dragging a knee

Or

move the TP up

Or

Go faster

 

Of course putting all of this in to consistent practice is an entirely different matter.

 

Tweak and Ace are right on that point....!

 

Bullet

[Mr Clauds]

Thanks Gents.

 

Im already tipping the bike over pretty hard and normally later than most.

But I'll see if I can go any deeper.

 

The thing is the racers are going in earlier than me and having better times...

 

Is it possible the bike combination makes that much of a difference?

My bike is stock standard and I sit into the machine instead of ontop... Also running on a harder compound road tyre...?

 

Im getting some pictures tom from the track day and I'll post them up to see if I can lean off any more by guidance from you guys

 

Should I look at putting adjustable rearsets on?

And setting it up so that the pegs scrape a few mm from any other hard parts?

 

Any other ideas on working on sense of speed?

[acebobby]

Thanks Gents.

 

Im already tipping the bike over pretty hard and normally later than most.

But I'll see if I can go any deeper.

 

The thing is the racers are going in earlier than me and having better times...

 

Is it possible the bike combination makes that much of a difference?

My bike is stock standard and I sit into the machine instead of ontop... Also running on a harder compound road tyre...?

 

Im getting some pictures tom from the track day and I'll post them up to see if I can lean off any more by guidance from you guys

 

Should I look at putting adjustable rearsets on?

And setting it up so that the pegs scrape a few mm from any other hard parts?

 

Any other ideas on working on sense of speed?

 

 

I dont think the answer is to go in any deeper, but maybe try to use the same turn point and to start with the same entry speed, 2 step the turn so that you use the same line but increase only the speed you steer the bike then if my interpritation of TOTW2 is correct you should be going round the corner at the same speed as before but without leaning the bike as much!

[Bullet]

Your other option of course is to make sure the suspension sag is correct, as incorrect springs for your weight and the bike will make it sit lower. You've not talked about this as a consideration, but its impotrant for sure!

 

Bullet

[Mr Clauds]

After looking at some of the pics more carefully, Im glad to see my body position had improved, but see that I can still go that little bit further with my head and shoulders.

 

Thanks for that bullet. Didn't even want to look into any of that since I truly wanted to get to the limit of the machine as it is... Although I did click preload up 1 notch (which is simply not enough for the track). And compression and rebound half a turn stiffer.

 

Can I please have critiques to the acommpanying picture?

Thanks