[Signing Up For School And Question About Equipment Rental]

Try jojo@motonation.com I think the "j" was a typo.

 

 

You're correct, it was an error - it has been edited and fixed now.

[Most Common Mistake You See In Yourself]

I sometimes get a little too attached to my reference points - stare at them just a little too long (mostly it's the apex of corners that I look at for too long), which chops up my visual flow and affects my mid-corner speed. It happens when I get a little tired and start losing my wide view - and it indicates that I really don't have ENOUGH reference points to pull my eyes along smoothly.

 

Oh, and when I get into a left turn a little too fast I always want to tense up my left arm. I rode a different bike yesterday and didn't have that problem - apparently I am not getting a good knee lock on my regular bike!

[Dunlop Model To Use?]

Hi,

I have a new bike, it is one of those 450 Super Single conversions. It has Pirelli slicks on it now, 120/70/17 front and 160/55/17 rear. I'd like to put Dunlops on it but I'm not sure which model to use and which are available for a 160 rear.

 

I LOVE the way the Q2s handle, but I will be racing and need to run tire warmers, and I'm not sure the Q2s do well with warmers, especially if the warmers aren't temperature adjustable - mine get really hot.

 

I prefer a more rounded profile, intead of a V shape, and I don't particularly like really stiff carcass tires. (See why I like the Q2 so much?) The bike is relatively low horsepower - 40 or so, I think.

 

Which Dunlop would be the best to suit my preferences? I am in the US, will be racing it with WERA, and my classes do allow slicks. First race will be this weekend at Vegas and the weather is looking cool, 40-55 F.

 

Thanks in advance for the advice!

[Saving Your Bacon]

OK, I have a new 'How CSS training saved my bacon' story. On Sunday I did an open track day - on a new, unfamiliar, poorly set up bike with a REALLY nice paint job. I definitely did not want to crash this bike.

 

I had just turned the bike into a tight slow corner, and a rider in front of me added throttle and lean angle exiting the corner and crashed - right in my path. His bike was spinning around mid track and I couldn't tell where it was going to end up, and the rider was sliding towards the outside edge of the track; it seemed too risky to go between them and the gap to the outside was closing as the rider slid. Without CSS training I would have just ridden off the outside into the dirt - all my instincts made me want to keep watching the moving rider, the thing I was afraid of hitting. It took a strong conscious effort to drag my eyes away to find a path to the inside that missed both sliding rider and spinning bike and kept me on the track.

 

Thank you CSS; going off track could very likely have resulted in a crash, but instead I was able to get my eyes up (recognize and overcome the target-fixation SR) and get around the obstacle cleanly.

[Experiments With Turn In]

OK, got it, that all makes sense. Let's tackle these one at a time.

 

"with #2, I never had enough throttle control fineness to give handlebars inputs while crack open the throttle and keep it steady till apex."

 

Agreed, it would take a lot of finesse and concentration to do this. One way to get a similar result with less effort is to increase the idle speed of your bike so the RPMs don't fall off so far when you let off the throttle. You could try increasing it 500-1,000 rpm and see if it helps the bike feels a bit more stable at tip-in. Be cautious of entry speed in your first few turns after adjusting it, because your bike is likely slow down a little less than before.

 

"when doing #3, I'm worrie about overloading front tire and wash out."

 

Cornering forces plus braking forces do put a lot of load on the front tire, and it does take careful brake control to manage this technique. Again, this can cost a lot of your attention which may be better spent on other things - like looking ahead at reference points! Trail braking is a more advanced technique, does have some additional risk of overloading the front, and should probably used judiciously - if you do a forum search you can find plenty of discussions about when and where it might make sense to do it.

 

"my worrie with #1 is: when I let go the brakes for tip in, it automatically extends the forks which unloads the tire and you lose traction."

 

If the forks extend between when you release the brakes and when you turn in, it makes the bike feel unstable, which is unnerving for sure. Here are a couple of things you can do to handle this:

 

1) Have a suspension person take a look at your bike, your front rebound may be too quick (the rebound damping set too soft) so it springs back too sharply after braking. The compression (or preload) could also be too soft causing the front end to dive excessively under braking.

 

2) The ideal is to be tapering off the brakes as you approach your turn point, ideally releasing the brake right when you turn in. The cornering force compresses your front end, so when the timing is right the front end load transfers from braking load to cornering load so it is never unloaded. If, however, you brake hard, release the brake abruptly, coast for bit, THEN turn in, you get the forks compressing, extending, and compressing again. If your front suspension is really soft, this can be dramatic and a little disconcerting!

 

A good way to accomplish your braking is to apply the brakes smoothly (not a stab) at the beginning of your braking zone, get the bulk of the braking done at the beginning, then taper off the braking as you approach your turn point, releasing it just as you turn the bike. That way there is never a chance for the front to pop up sharply (because you are tapering off your braking), even if your conering force is much lower than your braking force (which would be the case if you were to brake very hard but take the corner at a tentative pace). As the pace comes up, the cornering force is greater, so you dont' have to taper the brakes off quite so gradually to keep the front down through the corner.

 

I'm not sure what you have or haven't done with your suspension but it is VERY common for the front to be too soft on a street bike, so do have someone look at your suspension settings. When set up right, not only will the bike feel more planted and stable, it will be easier to turn the bike when the front stays partially compressed through your whole braking/turning action.

 

Does that help?

[Experiments With Turn In]

Hi there.

This is my first post but I've been watching this forum for a long time.

 

Well, I'm also facing this "throttle before slow turns crysis", and I really need your help.

 

So, I'm from Brazil and already did the Alex Barros Riding School (former brazilian MotoGP racer, I bet you remember him) and, after 7 trackdays, I still didnt decided how to proceed before slow turns.

 

When I attack fast corners, its all pretty clear for me: slightly roll off the throttle and keep it steady while leaning/counter steering (same technique for downhill corners and for the second leg of an Esse), but, for slow corners, man, what a doubt.

 

So, I'll tell you the approachs I've been trying, but still didnt felt confortable with neither.

 

1) Alex Barros: roll off while braking - till you reach zero throttle - let go your brakes, tip in, follow TCR1. Motovudu also states the same.

 

2) Dave Moss: same as Barros's teaches, but before you tip in, crack open the throttle, like a hair open, keep it steady till apex, and then follow TCR1.

 

3) Nick Ienatsch: roll off while braking, tip in with zero throttle & trailing the brakes till apex; then, follow TCR1.

 

So, what do you guys use as an effective technique?

I already try all above, but Im not really confident with none of them.

 

This is killing me... I lose focus thinking about what technique should I use at each slow corner.

I need to decide previously which one of them, so its one less thing to think about on my riding and have more fun.

 

Thanks.

 

CSS focuses primarily on number 1, although trail braking (#3) is used in certain types of corners or racing situations (generally tight corners after a straight that have a fast entrance and slow exit, or as a passing move).

 

What, specifically, is the doubt in your mind when approaching those slow corners? What are you worried will happen when you apply that first technique?

[Most Common Mistake You See In Other Riders?]

I see lots of riders turning in early - which is often followed by tense arms, poor throttle control then running wide which requires a steering correction, and in aggressive riders that can mean adding throttle and lean angle simultaneously at the end of the corners.

 

Something I see a lot on the freeway is riding duck-footed (toes hanging down close to the ground) which often indicates inexperience.

 

My husband chimed in on this one to say he sees a lot of riders hanging on too tight - shaking out stiff hands at stop lights.

[Video From India]

In this video, it is mentioned that they want to have more Indian racers in worldwide racing events. Dylan says that it's a needle in a haystack type thing, that they need to see tons of riders to find the ones that the potential to succed in racing.

 

So my question is: How do you know? In looking at the thousands of riders that come through the schools, how do you identify the ones with that potential? What do you look for - someone that shows up already fast? Someone who makes tons of improvement in one day? Jaw grinding determination? Unlimited budget and plenty of free time?

 

If you do find someone that seems to have something special, do you do anything about that, or just wait to see if they chase it and succeed?

[What Used To Scare You, And Doesn't Anymore?]

Time really... and a bit of mental focus to stay on task.

 

2 things, I ride a 250 (no damper) quite a bit and she likes to chatter a lot while cornering hard. Next is my stock R6, again no damper. It used to be every time the front would come up (most likely my fault for being tight on the bars), I would get head shake and have a pucker moment. Now when the bike just shimmies a little bit, I don't fight it. In fact, I don't do anything correct it. I just keep doing what I am supposed to be doing with the throttle, keep loose and calm. At this point I just mostly ignore it until it's "really" a problem.

 

Cool that you can calmly ride through it... but, what is causing the chatter? Is it something that can be eliminated with a different tire or suspension changes? When does it chatter, on the entrances or exits? On the brakes or on the gas?

[What Used To Scare You, And Doesn't Anymore?]

Braking deep and head shake. Got over both slowly but surely.

 

 

What got you over the concern about the head shake?

[Bike Technology Vs Riding Technology]

I never did ride anything older than a 1985 or so bike - but I have low tech bikes and high tech bikes, and the high tech bikes make me WANT to ride fast! There is a real invitation to eat up corners and twist the throttle harder. Like riding a thoroughbred instead of a plow horse - you can feel that it wants to RUN, not just haul groceries.

 

I think the newer bikes invite us to ride harder, push the limits more, head to the racetrack!

[What Used To Scare You, And Doesn't Anymore?]

I was thinking as I was driving on the freeway about how many things used to scare me, about riding motorcycles, before I came to the Superbike School.

 

For example, the rain grooves on the freeway make the bike feel weird and used to make me nervous. One of the drills at the school completely eliminated that fear.

 

So I thought I'd ask - what are some things that YOU were afraid of, about riding, and aren't anymore?

[Tire Age On Sidewall]

Here's a question. This is a great chance to get your bike on a track and see what it can really do. If you start pushing your own limits, and your bike's, far beyond what you have ever done before, will you begin to worry about whether your tires have optimal grip? Or as much grip as the guy in front of you, or your coach has, on his/her bike? Will that become a distraction?

 

5 years old sounds borderline to me - I didn't find exact guidelines but in researching it a bit, there seems to be a lot of recommendations that any motorcycle tire that is six years old or older should be changed, and more like 3-4 years for track riding; since tires tend to dry out and get less pliable with age, it sounds like a 5 year old tire might be fine for street riding but not have the grip for spiriting cornering that a new tire would have.

 

Our tire expert will have better info, of course!

 

Regarding reserving a bike - you do want to make that decision in advance (ASAP, really); there are a limited number of spaces available for students on rented bikes, the school needs to know ahead of time.

 

[Understanding That I Have Never Cornered A Motorcycle]

Just read an old test of the 1986 Ninja 250. Among the scenarios it was put through, was a day at Willows. Reaching an indicated 100 mph over the straight, it headed into turn one with the throttle wide open, yet lost 25 mph through the corner! In fact, cornering zapped so much power that they had to shift down at the exit of most corners to get enough power to continue, despite having the throttle pinned virtually the whole lap.

 

I cannot recall ever having cornered hard enough to lose 25 mph from friction losses. Not even close. Hence the conclusion that I really haven't cornered.

 

So... just out of curiosity, how much speed DO you think you lose (or have lost) in a given corner? I'm not sure that is the easiest thing to figure out or observe, unless you have telemetry to tell you. My racebikes don't have speedos but even if they did I'd be unwilling to look at the speedometer at wide-open throttle at 100 mph at turn in and again immediately after!

 

(I do have a GPS timer that could probably tell me.... if I could get around to setting up the software and comm link to a laptop.)

 

BTW, Turn 1 at Willow IS uphill, and banked (and a comonly used line DOES partially climb the bank), and I think the last bit of straight before it is uphill also. The poor Ninjas are doing everything they can just to overcome the wind drag at 100mph, let alone go up a hill...

 

I wonder if a sharp lane change on the freeway (without changing throttle position) would generate enough friction loss to see a noticeable change on a digital speedo?

 

And I do so agree that Ninja 250 racing is a blast, easy to get into and relatively cheap and really competitive. The grids are pretty big right now, although the advent of the Ninja 300 may cause trouble by splitting up the grid into two separate classes.

[Vir May 13/14]

what all is in your packet? was it mailed or emailed?

 

The packet will have instructions, track address and directions, and release forms. Normally it is emailed. If you haven't received one you may want to call the school at 800-530-3350 or email Whitney at registration@superbikeschool.com.

[Hello From Florida]

Welcome aboard!

[Race Start/launch - How To Do It?]

 

 

 

Which year's S1000 do you have?

 

2011, and I ride a 2012 with the school. 2013's are being prepped now, we'll be using those starting next month. Wheeee....

[How Does This Happen?]

It looks to me like he tried turning in while on the brakes and overloaded the front tire on the wet pavement. Stiff arms could definitely contribute to overloading the front, and although the rider appears fairly relaxed, you can see that his left arm is pretty straight right before he turns in, and when he goes down his arm looks braced and appears to fling him away from the bars. Maybe he was leaning on the bars and adding unwanted weight or steering input.

 

Can anyone list the conditions (hint: look in Twist II) that can cause a rider to lose the front when quickturning the bike?

[Taming A 2 Stroke!]

That's a GREAT looking bike! Glad to hear it went well, thanks for the pics!!!

[Race Start/launch - How To Do It?]

Hotfoot - Correct.The launch rpm dips with the rise in power output.Which is why i wanted people who ride bigger bikes share their experience with starts.Hope the coaches at CSBK will turn up soon and share their insight .

 

Thanks

 

Oh, sorry, I misunderstood, thought you were looking for info on the 250.

 

I am a coach with the school. I own a BMW S1000rr and have raced it and also a ZX6R. I didn't quite catch your question - but based on your original post questions, I'll share experience with those, FWIW:

 

The ZX6R I would launch at around 10,000 rpm. Modulating the clutch was the tricky part. The RPMs didn't dip much UNLESS they were too low to begin with, in which case the RPMs fell and the bike bogged. I did not use the clutch to upshift on that bike either.

 

The BMW is challenging, it has unbelievable power - I do race starts on that one at about 6,000 rpm, way below the max torque rpm, and let the clutch out very slowly and gradually. The RPMs don't dip. It has a quick shifter, so no clutch for the upshift. My husband races a BMW, too, but he has trouble with the wheelie control kicking in and reducing the power. He solved it temporarily by launching at 4,000 rpm, which launches it without a wheelie but isn't competitive in a race so he has just had some suspension work done to try to minimize the problem. We raced 2 weeks ago, and his starts were better, he still gets a small wheelie but not enough to engage the control, and he was able to use a higher RPM.

 

I'm not sure why he has that problem and I don't - could be weight, body position, or clutch/throttle control. I usually ride a different S1000, which is newer and has a different algorithm for the wheelie control, that could be part of it, too - I need to try some starts on his again and see if it responds differently with me aboard.

 

I've never had a problem with wheelspin; we always use race tires and warmers, a wheelie always seems to happen long before wheelspin.

[Race Start/launch - How To Do It?]

I mentioned smaller displacement bikes, as my experience is limited to them.On them, launching at peak torque is the best way to do it, as wheelspin seldom occurs and the power can be modulated with the clutch.

 

On larger displacement bikes, you launch at whatever is the highest rpm that doesn't overpower the tire.It could be as low as 3000-3500 rpm on a busa.The V-Max is one of the most powerful bikes there is, and bikes like that should probably be launched even lower.

 

Either on all bikes, whatever rev range that gives you max power with min traction loss.

 

My 250 does best at 7-8000 rpm. I did some racing in Ninja 250s, too (which is big fun, by the way) and I seem to recall they were best in around that range, too. You'll have to experiment to see what works for you, but 7,000 RPM ought to be a reasonable place to begin.

[Race Start/launch - How To Do It?]

Ooh, that sounds fun!

[Race Start/launch - How To Do It?]

Let me first mention that if you come to a CodeRace school, you can get individually coached on this, which is the best way to find what works best for you.

 

What's 'correct' is likely to vary from bike to bike and rider to rider, depending on individual strengths, but I'll tell you what I do:

 

I do blip the throttle to shift. You may find that it takes more of a blip to get the shift at higher RPMs than it did it lower.

 

You also might find that you have to shift sooner than you expect - you run out of first gear quickly on an aggressive start. You don't want to hit the rev limiter, the delay will lose you positions.

 

Usually during practice you can get the chance to do some practice starts and I highly recommend this - race nerves can cause errors, like dropping the clutch too abruptly and getting a surprise wheelie (even on a 250!). Practice starts can help you get comfortable and figure out the shift timing. Also it is a good idea to do some practice starts because on some tracks the first turn feels different from the start line than it did from pit lane or when going around a lap - you may be coming in faster or slower or at a different angle. You'll want to find reference points for braking, turn point, etc.

[Racing Vision]

Interesting question!

 

For me, if the rider is a lot slower, I try to ignore them (treat 'em like a traffic cone!) and get by as quickly as possible, preferably without losing ANY of my momentum. If the rider is a little slower, I look for a way to get by as soon as possible - I might have to take a weird line to do it, but since they are slowing me down anyway I should be at a comfortable pace to change my line if needed. I look for an available line that I can take - I have awareness of the other rider but I don't look at him/her.

 

I think the worst thing to do (in a race) is watch and follow a slightly slower rider - it slows you down, often more than you realize, and suddenly the guys behind you start overtaking you and now you have two or three guys in your way instead of one!

 

If the rider is in front of me and fast and blocking my view of my reference point, personally I look 'through' the rider at my reference point, visualizing where it is. I am aware of the other rider, keep him in view in case I see him losing control and endangering me. I ride my own line, as fast as I can and watch for him to make a mistake. On a practice day I might watch and follow and try the other rider's line but I am cautious about doing that in a race, can't afford to lose time if it doesn't work out. I used to do it but I generally lost more than I gained - a lot of riders charge turns and following them often ended up with me braking too late, overbraking, then stiff on the bars through the turn, ending with me late on the throttle and/or running wide.

 

If a rider is erratic or appears to be riding beyond his own skill level, I tend to hang back a little so I can see him and have time to react if he cuts across my front wheel or falls down. I look for a chance to pass safely, preferably on the inside so that if he falls or runs off he doesn't take me out.

 

During starts there can be so many riders in front of you that you can't see much of the track at all. In that case I visualize where I think my points are, and get as close to them as I can based on the riding room available.

 

I have found that trying to watch individual riders during a crowded start ends up with frantic looking around, overreacting to everyone, making too many changes to my line and essentially slowing down to get out of everyone's way. Keeping a wide view with awareness of everyone but focusing on my desired line works a lot better. Keith's article about Presence is a good thing to read regarding crowded starts.

 

The one time I DO watch a rider in front is on the turn exits and straightaways, when I am trying to "reel 'em in", I find that trying to gain on the other rider gives me a bit more motivation to get the bike pointed down the track and get the throttle wide open sooner.

[Muscle And Joint Supplements]

 

I have a pretty rigorous workout routine(combo of weightlifting and a lot of running)

 

 

What are you doing, stealing TVs?

 

Just kidding - I am interested in this question, too!