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Highsiding Without The Gas , Possible ?


teg
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http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x5f91y/_crash-de-lorenzo-chine2008_sport

 

hello all

having not been out on track since november (hopefully next couple of weeks) been doing some bench biking and rebuilding front calipers on the srad , ( done level 4 twice now and i do about 10 - 12 track days a year )

i was looking at some footage of Lorenzo,s qualifying 2008 highside crash (O U C H !!!) in shanghai china.

i tried to add a link to some slo mo footage on you tube but couldn,t get it to work or how to add my photo card . so i typed in address to link above you should be able to get footage if not should be on you tube the on above has a slo mo .

maybe someone can add a better link if not .

 

anyway i was looking at this footage and to me seemed a bit unusual , i started asking myself is it possible to highside without the gas , my conclusions are yes although these crashes are a lot rarer than the usual highside which normally takes place between apex and exit as the rider gets hard on the gas ( the pick up drill helping people like me handle any small rear slides at my level )

 

in this crash he highsides in the 2nd part , the left hander of a chicane after exiting the right hander but seems to me to not even make the apex in the left hander or even get back to the throttle b-4 a big highside . Although i realise at this level he would be carrying massive corner speed / momentum .

 

my humble observations are that as he exits the right hander picking the bike up the front wheel is off the ground and already counter steered to the right as it lands right as he tips in to the left hander steering him to quick and leant too much as the forks bottom out at the same time , also not giving him enough time to switch body position in time and lock in with his outside leg adding a bit of unwanted arms input , auto throttle ? .

i,m assuming that the fully bottoming and fully unloading forks poggoed the rear of the bike also making it unload and load firing the poor rider over the top .

a culmination of a lot of things at a bad point i guess mabe cold tyres too ?

any other observations , i,m sure you experts can give me the short version .

 

many moons ago after a succesful small lame slide on the schools slide bike at my 2nd attempt i high sided it but it was b-4 i got back to the throttle , coaches told me i had turned too quick or with too much lean b-4 i got a chance to give it a handful of gas . i bet i also got some unwanted arm input and pogoed the forks up and down too no doubt .

yes i was going considerably slower than Lorenzo!!!

 

anyway my conclusions are yes you can highside without the gas although this is rare as is both front and rear tyres sliding out but can happen .

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whoops , i think i should have put this in school questions , if admin is watching and thinks better feel free to move it ,

cheers .

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I can't watch the video, but I don't think highside can happen without acceleration. It's the acceleration that causes the tire to lose traction before it subsequently regains traction in a highside. If it were possible, the highside would be very small because it's that increase in power that causes massive compression and a good launch.

If you would bottom out your forks with cold or heated tires in a turn, the front end would wash. It wouldn't be the cause of a highside.

You would need increased power to highside would be my guess. If between corners the guys front wheel came off the ground, he was on the gas.

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In order for a bike to highside, the back must slide and then catch (that's a highside, but normally means the rider crashed by falling getting pitched off the high side). Could possibly happen if the back hit something more slippery than the front?

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In order for a bike to highside, the back must slide and then catch (that's a highside, but normally means the rider crashed by falling getting pitched off the high side). Could possibly happen if the back hit something more slippery than the front?

Possibly. If it hit something slippery I'd think the possibility of the tire just giving out would be more possible. Maybe the angle of lean when you hit the patch would have a great effect on what happens.

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thanks for chiming in people !

thought i was on my own on this 1 .....

i seem to always looking for awkward asnwers / questions (not delibaretly)

I do understand the concept of the high side crash with the application of throttle and the slide catch / loading / sudden unload as the catch , grip occurs firing the unfortunate victim skywards .

 

 

Out of interest i did an important piece of info this week that may also get your brains ticking and mine that i didn,t realise the steepness of the hill the chicane is on which no doubt was a big contributor to the suspension unloading .

i know you guys probably can,t see the footage should be available somewhere on a search .

 

???????? maybe there is a small application of throttle too and i just can,t see it ,anyway it,s a big highside .

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  • 2 weeks later...

I've had the back come around on me on corner entry in the rain on School ZX-10s and my own ZX-10. I'd be off the throttle coming to my turn point, turn in and the back would start coming around. I'm pretty certain that could end in a highside.

 

In the dry, at Palm Beach International Raceway there's a turn combination of a 90 right, an easy left that you accelerate through and then an increasing radius right that you have to roll off for just a bit and flick it over to your knee. The roll off and turn point for the last right are almost one and the same so you can feel the bike want to pitch to the side as you turn the bike in off throttle. Charge that corner and hit the brakes and I think that the bike would throw you off.

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thats interesting greg .

i,ve been watchin this with interest and i also think it may be possible in certain cicumstances .

i think too that it may be possible and your feedback from a riders point of view is of course the best test .

hopefully someone else will have a bit of input too .

 

maybe its that real fine line like maybe when the rear starts to slide but does a slide catch , slide catch instead of a nice consistent slide , and b-4 the rider has a a chance for any throttle input one of the catch moments throws it into a high side , sounds unlikely but i guess if the momentum and steering input was quick enough and the flick to full lean quick enough with negative camber say or downhill , and that little catch moment was enough ............

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