Hotfoot
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Posts posted by Hotfoot
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got it. Next time somebody says "loud handle", I'll know what it means. lol. More than knowing that a technique works is knowing that experienced riders use it.
Hook turn works REALLY well on the S1000rrs! We just did some days in the rain and I used hook turn a lot, especially as I was first learning the track, to tighten up my line without adding any lean angle, since I was concerned about the amount of grip available.
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After just coming back from Circuit of the Americas, I wanted to post up some things I noticed about the school. I am a coach, as many of you here already know, but at COTA last week I coached for two days then was a student for two days (because it's fun, and there is always more to learn).
The thing that really struck me is how much the school continues to evolve, how much NEW stuff there is all the time. I coach often and I'm usually a student at least once or twice a year, and yet at almost every school I attend there is something new - a new coaching tool, a new demonstration technique, new Level 4 drills, new equipment, new ideas.... all the time! After so many years in business it is astonishing that the school continues to be so dynamic, observing and integrating new technologies that come from MotoGP and other areas, and constantly refining and adding to the coaching toolbox and student experience.
There are many examples I could share but here is one: even though this was the first time at COTA for CSS, they already had specific close up pictures of the track on screen (ipad and laptops) in the hands of the Level 4 consultants to use for discussion of various line options through corners, etc.; plus some really great close up video clips and photos of pro riders (including slo-mo and freeze frame) to explain to everyone (not just Level 4) various body position techniques and to discuss suspension movement and bike handling in corners.
There is also new data available on the camera bike, dozens of new Level 4 drills, Dylan was spending some time showing some interested students all the data you can see from the Data Logger, and much more.
I was impressed - I'm not sure how anyone could ever get bored or run out of stuff to explore with CSS, and I guess that is proven by the number of students (like me) who come back for Level 4 so many times and at so many tracks.
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So if you do pro-racing style and hook early in the turn only to find that you are running too tight, unhooking doesn't seem correct somehow. Steering correction seems the safer way to go?
There is another way to widen your arc without adding a steering input (and without changing body position), who knows what that is?
Turn the loud handle.
Bingo!
Wishy Thinky, if you are riding in a steady circle in a parking lot, and you add throttle and increase your speed, without changing anything else, what happens to the diameter of your circle?
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We just did four days of school at COTA. Great facility, and if you are looking for a place to let loose the reins on the S1000RR, it is definitely a good place for that, there are two REALLY long straights and you can let it rip.
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So if you do pro-racing style and hook early in the turn only to find that you are running too tight, unhooking doesn't seem correct somehow. Steering correction seems the safer way to go?
There is another way to widen your arc without adding a steering input (and without changing body position), who knows what that is?
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It seems that lv4 at CSS doesn't have classroom instructions? maybe neither does lv3? One could argue about knowledge vs practice 'til blue in the face, but for me understanding why things work matters a lot. Personally, I think that I would find value in knowing the differences in techniques. If it doesn't take away from riding time or normal curriculum in lv3 or lv4, it would be helpful to insert discussion at school about the different techniques. Marquez does this, Rossi does that, Lorenzo does this, this works for him because of his long legs, that works for this other guy because he's flexible, Pedrosa has to do it this way because he's smaller, this is the best technique for racing but normal people don't have the flexibility to achieve it, etc. That kind of discussion would be very useful.
Level 4 DOES have classroom, and so does Level 3. In Level 3 there is a lot of focus on relationship of bike and rider - body position, lock on, staying connected to the bike during transitions, steering effectiveness, etc., so the classroom portion involves a demonstration BIKE and students are put ON the bike IN the classroom to get a real understanding of the drills and techniques. I'm not sure what would give you the impression that there is no Level 3 classroom instruction - except sometimes the logistics of using an actual bike (like upstairs classrooms) means the Level 3 class is done in a different area than Level 1 and 2, in a garage or shaded outside area.
For Level 4 the classroom instruction is tailored specifically to the student. You are assigned a L4 consultant, who is your classroom instructor, plus an on-track coach. Your L4 consultant works with you and your coach to figure out a plan for your day, and your classroom time is customized to the particular areas you are working on - which gives you the opportunity for in-depth, one-one-one discussion of techniques and specific ways for YOU to apply them, and it is a terrific opportunity to ask the questions you pose above - coaches can't ALWAYS identify why a certain racer rides a certain way (for example, sometimes they are compensating for an old - or current - injury, or a bike setup problem, which can look rather mysterious if you don't know about those factors) but they can certainly discuss the benefits of various techniques you see used by various riders. You can also listen in on what other students in L4 are working on, which is usually extremely informative as well. It's customized training and coaching and it is great. It is a long, long way from just riding around.
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Ok, it's kinda weird to argue with someone expressing their OPINION that CSS is the best, especially here on the CSS forum! I think it was evident in Tyler's post that he meant CSS is the best, in his experience, since he did not speciifically compare to a list of other track days or schools, nor was he claiming to be an exceptional authority on the subject, other than having done a lot of days with CSS.
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Having completed Level 1 & 2 now I totally understand why CSS uses the S1000RR. That bike is absolutely perfect for training on the track. I mean it handles so well, sticky Q3s' and that quick shifter is completely amazing. I wasn't used to it because all of my bikes were clutch/gears but the S1000RR has that quick shifter which allows you to focus on all things you need to keep your drive, line and hitting all your marks. Hats off to CSS for selecting such a great machine. Honestly, now I'm really tempted to have one in my garage?
Just watch out. I ended up with two of them much the same way. Not that I'm complaining at all. One of the best motorcycles I have ever ridden.
now I'm really tempted. There's more than one in my garage, too. They are awesome.
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1. waste of time?
2. going to level 4 with only 3 track days previously, is that like playing competitive basketball while being only 4 foot tall, or going straight to college after "graduating" from kindergarden, or going for liquor after your first lite beer, or wanting to becoming a supermodel after posting your first photo on the internet via facebook?
p.s. I live where the curvy roads are the clover leaf freeway on/off ramps.
Lots of repeat students come to CSS instead of doing track days.Why? Here are a few reasons:
1) Fewer riders on track - especially for 2 day camps!
2) Much safer riding environment - as an example, my local trackday has an AVERAGE of 12 crashes per day. CSS has lots of zero-crash days (with an overall average of less than one per day); CSS corner workers are trained to spot riding errors, dangerous riding, close passing, etc. (as are the coaches) and these things are handled immediately. Course control at regular trackdays is highly variable, some providers do a better job than others...
3) Coaching! Just because you haven't had a lot of practice time since your last school doesn't mean you can't or won't make big improvements in your riding in your next CSS day. In Level 4 you and your coach and your L4 consultant will work together to make a plan for your day, and adjust it throughout the day - so you can ride with a plan for improvement, instead of just riding around.
4) Track opportunities - you can rent a bike and even rent gear, so you can travel to tracks all over the country!
5) As FieryRobot says above, what you learn at CSS does translate to road riding, even if you don't have a lot of curvy roads to work with. Having better control of your motorcycle and riding comfortably with the minimum effort is always helpful, and even more so if you have to stop suddenly, swerve sharply, deal with slippery conditions, etc.
6) Plus - as said above - it's FUN! Everyone is very friendly and there is a lot of support - student services, water, electrolytes, mechanic, etc. to make your day easier, more productive, and more enjoyable.
(FYI, personally, for me, as a student, I often chose CSS over track days PRIMARILY because of the safety factor. Open track days, and road riding, for that matter, can be scary, where CSS days always felt very comfortable, friendly and safe for me. That being said, the major benefit afterwards was always the coaching and the improvements I made. Now I mostly choose 2 day camps to go to new, far away tracks, and I always have a blast.)
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Yes, and there are multiple parts to that process (although video review, as far as I know, is not normally a part of it). The registrar makes a note of any special requests - such as friends wanting to ride in the same group, requests for a particular coach, or any other special considerations, and these comments are passed along to the appropriate person depending on whether it affects student services (something to do with food or riding gear) or coach assignment or something to do with the bike.
As the school date approaches, the coach/student assignments are the responsibility of the Chief Riding Coach or Deputy Chief Riding Coach, who ensure that students are matched with an appropriate coach. Every coach is qualified to teach every level, but there may be special considerations, like matching up a racer to a coach with lots of race experience, or putting a student who normally rides a small bike like an RS 125 with a coach who is familiar with the characteristics of that machine, etc.
The Chief Riding Coach and/or Deputy Chief Riding coach communicate with the assigned coach on returning students about student history. Sometimes the rider's prior coach meets with that day's assigned coach to pass along info from the student's prior schools.
Additionally, Course Control keeps detailed notes on EVERY student and your example of someone who crashed would be something Course Control would know, and if warranted, would discuss with the CRC and/or the assigned coach. (Course Control handles making sure the riding environment is safe and predictable, and any dangerous or inconsiderate riders are asked to leave and are not allowed to return.) A rider who is simply over-enthusiastic and inclined to ride a little over their head would be reminded to ride within their limits, both by Course Control and by their riding coach, who is always in close communication with Course Control on ALL students.
The Superbike School staff is composed of a lot of long term employees and returning students are also generally recognized and remembered by coaches, student services staff, and Course Control.
One note, though, as far as I know student records are not shared between branches of the school - in other words, if you took a school in the UK or Australia branch, the USA branch would probably not have your riding history information.
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Hi everyone,
I was wondering if anyone could tell me how CSS sets up in the North Paddock for VIR. I will be heading down there Sunday, and I want to try to park as close as possible to where the trailers and bikes will be set up. I am bringing my own bike, so I just want to make sure my tools and the what-not will be close by.
Does CSS set up on the West side (by the suites) or the East side (by the showers and food)? Since I will be arriving Sunday, I am hoping I can just find a prime parking spot to leave the van in.
Also, anyone else here going? My buddy and I will be heading down from DC for Monday and Tuesday. He'll be using the school bikes for his first time on track. I'll be on a primer grey Ninja 300.
Thanks!
The school sets up by the showers and food - as you drive into the parking lot towards the building and hot pit entrance, with the showers on your right, the school sets up in the middle of the big parking lot. The school bikes get parked in the lot between the classroom building and the barn-type building across from it. Usually most of that will get set up the evening prior, so the trailers etc. may already be in place when you arrive. If I remember correctly, I believe student bikes and pit area is against the fence on the track side, but not between the hot pit entrance from the building, on the other (parking lot) side of the hot pit entrance.
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Rad!!
Silly me but what that coach.
Short for "radical" which means very, very cool; awesome. Kind of an 80's California term... it is, after all, the California Superbike School, and the school lexicon reflects its heritage.
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Hello AxeManBlue,
Glad to hear you got to do the Level 3 course - it's pretty physical, huh? Good question about hip-flick - it is definitely challenging to keep weight off the bars going downhill. One thing you can do is to keep BOTH knees locked in on the tank while you shift your hips, and not release your inside knee until you drop your upper body into the turn. That way both knees are locked in while you are moving across the seat, and once your upper body is low and inside and you are in the turn, it will be easier to hold on with just the outside leg. It breaks the hip flick into two steps, which is something you may have seen demonstrated when the technique was first being explained.
Or, you may consider hanging off less or possibly even not at all, and/or keeping both knees locked in throughout the sequence of turns if they are quick back-and-forths that don't use a lot of lean angle. On the section of road you have in mind, which is more important, hanging off to reduce lean angle, or having really good steering accuracy? If it is the second, hanging off less might help you achieve a better lock in and therefore more accurate steering inputs and less weight on the bars.
For pivot steering, the knee connecting solidly to the tank is the primary pivot point, giving you a solid base from which to push strongly and accurately on the opposite bar. Pushing down on the peg is a way to get the leverage to push your knee into the tank. I personally can't think of any reason why it would be important to distinguish between how much you are pushing down on the peg versus how much you are pushing your knee into the tank. As long as you are seeing the result in confident, accurate steering with minimum effort and a good anchoring of the lower body to the bike, you are getting the benefits of the technique!
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Thanks! I actually took your suggestion of locking/hooking the leg around the bottom end of the tank. I felt more stable going into the turn, so again thanks.
Nice! So glad that helped.
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I agree with all said above except I would NOT recommend staying in Rosamond, we have had students experience car break ins at that place plus it's just not very nice.
Comfort Inn or the Holiday Inn Express in Lancaster are better.
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What a happy picture! Glad to see you meeting goals and having fun
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As far as I know the first time the term was published anywhere in regards to motorcycle riding was in Keith Code's book "A Twist of the Wrist", over 30 years ago (1983).
When the Twist books have been translated, I think in many cases they've had to come up with a word for countersteering, because there wasn't one in common use. I'm not sure if that makes Keith the one "in charge of all the motorcycle words"... but he really did write the book on motorcycle riding.
For sure he'd be the first person I'd ask if I needed a word to describe a riding technique! -
I think it was the sheer rideability and impressive capabilities of the BMW S1000rr in particular that drove the change from 600cc to 1000cc bikes at the school. In other words, it wasn't that the school switched bikes because they wanted to go from a 600 to a 1000, and went looking for a 1000cc bike to use - it was that the BMW S1000rr was (and is) a terrific machine that happens to BE a 1000cc bike.
I know I was enormously impressed the very first time I rode the S1000rr (I was previously on a ZX6R and had never ridden a liter bike). It was far easier to ride than I expected, and was overall friendlier and easier to ride than the 600 - despite being quite a bit more powerful once you really let it loose. I love riding it, and I bought one, too.
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Hee hee, that's pretty funny.
It's true, though, hanging off is fatiguing so it makes sense not to do it until you need to. Another consideration when coaching, is that it can be intimidating for some students, especially if they don't hang off at all, to see the coach ahead of them hanging off dramatically while going the same speed they are. It can give the impression that they must do that, too, to go that speed, and can cause distraction or unwanted pressure on the bars as they try to do it. Of course when we see a student having to lean the bike over a lot because they are going pretty quick, we DO start talking to them about body position to help them reduce that lean angle, and/or to go faster without having to lean the bike over even more.
There is definitely an argument to be made for hanging off the same way every time, for the sake of consistency and muscle memory, rather than adjusting body position based on pace. But for coaching, where the pace can vary quite a lot from student to student, for me personally it makes sense to only hang off when I need to.
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31 psi front and 30 rear, cold pressure.
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I'd seriously wonder if he is partly using his inside arm to hold himself up. That arm looks pretty straight, and the inside shoulder is forward, and his head and neck look a bit awkwardly tilted.
Those are things we normally try to avoid with a good lower body lock.
He does look to be using his heel and maybe his outside arm against the tank, and the cornering forces do help push you into the bike, so it isn't always as hard to stay on as it would be if you were just trying to hang onto a stationary, tilted bike.
Possibly the rider is sacrificing some lower body stability to get that knee down like that, or maybe there are some physical issues or bike issues that make that riding position better for him.
Is there something about this rider or photo that makes you want to emulate his position or style?
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Wow. What sort of contact did he make that crashed you? Did he hit your rear wheel hard?
I can see why you were mad! Any conversation with race officials on it?
Glad you were not hurt.
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A very similar question was asked very recently in this thread, you might want to take a look and see if it helps:
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The Q3's a GREAT tires, tons of grip for track, last a pretty long time and good initial price. The performance of the tires is awesome.
now I'm really tempted. 
Hook Turns
in Cornering and Techniques
Posted
The thing that increases the radius of your arc (assuming no steering input, no change in lean angle) is an increase in SPEED. Same lean angle at a higher speed = larger diameter circle.
One discussion we have had on the forum, and possibly the one you are thinking of, is that rolling on the gas does not change lean angle. There is a common misconception that rolling on the gas stands the bike up, but on a properly set up sport bike that is not true.
If you enter a high speed corner off-throttle, then gently crack open the gas, are you, at that point, speeding up, or could you still be slowing down?