Hotfoot
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Posts posted by Hotfoot
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quick one for u guys, im having trouble lasting the full 15min session when im at track day and i have a race meeting this week, problem is, my arms are going before i am casing me to come in early... im gripping the tank with legs but its still happening , any tips, thinking about maybe trying to anchor heel of boot on foor peg, to stop me put pressure on bars?? help..
Are you holding the grips gently with your hands or squeezing tight? There is no need to use a tight grip with your hands, if they are tight, relax them. Do your handlebars vibrate a lot? Weighted bar ends can calm down vibrations that can numb your arms.
Are you using a constant pressure to 'hold' your bike in the turns? This is not necessary... unless there is something really wrong with your bike's geometry.
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BOTH front tires, if you have them - I'd like to see the pro tire, too.
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Alright, I'll take a shot at this but I am not very knowledgeable in this area, so take it with a grain of salt. Looks to me like a dual compound tire with a harder compound in the center stripe, and a relatively soft (maybe too soft) compound everywhere else. Looks like the rider is putting down a lot of horsepower with the bike at a shallow lean angle - he/she probably has a good pick-up and uses it a lot, or else rides with more of a point-and shoot style that gets hard on the gas once the bike is pointed down track, instead of rolling on gradually while the bike is still leaned over a lot. This tire has a very pointy profile anyway but the wear has made that worse, and in this photo it does look like the right side has worn down significantly more than the left, indicating either a lot of right handers or an unequal tire compound for left versus right side - those do exist but I doubt that is the case here.
Again, I'm hardly an expert but from what I see, I would take a look at whether that tire is too soft for the track surface or weather conditions, and take a look at rider style to see if the tire could be made to last longer - maybe see if he/she could change the throttle control to get on the gas earlier and more gently in the turn and carry more speed through the corner rather than standing it up and driving hard on the exits, if the track has corners that are conducive to that and conditions allow. OR the rider could try a rounder-profile tire, it may allow him/her to ride with a more varying lean angle - the shape of this tire could be making the bike want to 'set' at a particular angle. It probably gives a TON of grip at that particular angle, though, and some riders like that feel. At that point it could become a trade-off between desired grip/feel versus how long you want a tire to last.
The wear pattern of the rubber itself looks OK to me (it is wearing a lot but it doesn't seem to be tearing, melting, or cupping) except for that strip right next to the center that looks extra-worn but I think that could be just the change in compound that makes it look odd there.
There is a only one thing I can say for sure about the conditions where this tire was used... there are a lot of little white rocks on the ground.
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Im for sliders with a tendency to glide on the ground on touchdown and ground off evenly than make the bike rotate around like a top (round protruding sliders are very guilty of this) .
Ah, I wonder if that is the reason for the teardrop shape of those R&G sliders, I never really thought about it but maybe that helps the slider slide straight instead of putting the bike into a spin.
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Well - here is a war story for you - my husband had a low side recently with the BMW S1000rr, it has the R&G frame sliders, which are the same ones the school uses. By the time the bike actually touched down (he tried pretty hard to save it!) it was probably going 35 mph. It slid and then it spun around. He picked it up and rode it back to the pits. The frame slider had been ground off about halfway, and there was NO OTHER visible damage on the bike. No fairing or paint damage, no lever damage, nothing. He took it to re-tech it and they teased him about it, asking him if he threw himself under the bike to save the paint.
He rode it in the next race ten minutes later. I have no doubt whatsoever that the slider saved him many $$ in paint and fairing damage, and probably saved his case-cover too.I've seen a number of low-sides where the only damaged parts are frame sliders, bar ends, and ground foot pegs and scraped levers. That is minor stuff that can be fixed in minutes, and the bike is rideable even before the repairs are made.
My take is that frame sliders, bar ends, spools, etc. are there to save you from minor-to-medium damage in low-sides, low speed falls, and parking lot tip-overs (which do happen, even to experienced racers, I've seen it happen when they forget to unplug something, or catch a handlebar on a EZ up tie-down, or make an error with a stand, for example).
For a high speed crash where the bike slides off the track, or a high-side... all bets are off, some bikes get lucky and survive pretty well and some catch a certain way and break all kinds of stuff. I can't speak to the shape of the sliders, except to say that I've seen some crashes where those long thick R&G sliders get ground halfway off or more and still have enough length to keep the paint off the pavement.
One caution is to research the type of sliders - if the slider has a thin, cheap bolt, or if the bolt-hole in the BIKE is too small, in a crash the bolt can bend or break (which smashes the slider into your fairing and cracks the fairing) or can rip the bolt out of the frame, causing damage to the frame. The S1000rr does not have a problem in this regard but as I recall some of the older ZX6Rs did have an issue.
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I suppose most of this theory goes out of the window when you are charging around the mountain?
Hee hee, I think ALL theory goes out the window, and you are left with pure REALITY!
Isn't that why they do it?
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Hugh,
I'm way bummed to hear about your injury. I would imagine that's a pretty horrifying experience but I'm glad it wasn't even worse. On the upside, chicks dig scars so... you've got that going for you. If nothing else, you now have a future as a shop teacher.
Are you gonna keep on racing? Out of curiosity, did you have a lever guard on your bike? Manufacturers claim that in addition to guarding the brake lever, they may also help prevent hand injuries. Not sure how true that is but I guess it seems plausible...
Best of luck,
Benny
The brake lever guard was one of those cheap chinese ones and it got torn out, leaving the end of the clipon bare. I can't help but wonder what would have happened if I had had a proper bar end in there. I had a better setup before - a custom RhinoMoto bar end with a Woodcraft lever guard attached - but that got ruined in a previous crash.
Not sure yet about future racing or even track riding. That is a conversation I need to have with my wife. This stuff really upsets her and at a certain point (like coming home with missing body parts) it seems a bit selfish to put her through it.
OK, the "coming home with missing body parts" made me laugh - you are doing an impressive job of maintaining your sense of humor through this whole thing.
My husband and I both race and we both worry about each other. Sometimes the risk of something happening to one of us makes me want to stop racing... but it seems like every time I give that any serious thought, something happens in EVERYDAY life that almost kills me (like a week ago when a speeding pickup truck very narrowly missed plowing into the back of my STOPPED car and squashing it - and me - like a bug) and suddenly track riding doesn't seem so foolishly risky anymore.
I'm not sure that is any help to hear right now, when the body still hurts and your wife is probably still upset, but I do want you to know that you aren't the only one that has asked yourself if this whole riding/racing thing is such a smart idea sometimes.
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Wow, so sorry to hear about your crash and your injury, that is a tough deal. Glad to hear the guy came over to apologize, for what it is worth.
I enjoy reading your blog, it is a great insight into racing - the good and the bad - and I'm sure the next installment will be an interesting one to read.
So... I can't believe no one else has asked... how's the bike?
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Definitely not. I used to brake and downshift then set up for my turn, but i realized i rushed my body positioning and sometimes i didnt set up properly because i was too rushed. Ive tried to shift my butt over first for a right turn but the downshifting and brsking felt a bit awkward as i am used to downshifting and braking with the butt on the seat. Itll just take time to get used to it.
Sounds like you have this figured out.
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Personally as long as I'm making improvements I'm happy. Knee on the asphalt or not.
My favorite quote of the day.
Thanks for your compliments, glad it was helpful. I always enjoy talking about motorcycles and riding!
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Let me just remind both Robert and Tyler that physical differences in the body (leg length, flexibility in the hips, etc.) and bike configuration (rearset position, tank shape, etc.) can have a considerable influence on how easy or difficult it can be to get the knee down, even with steep lean angles and good body position. For example, I have three bikes. On one I can get my knee down consistently and on another occasionally, but on the third one, I am not anywhere near touching my knee. The third bike is taller, has an odd tank shape and REALLY high rearsets.
I know both of you guys, and you are built totally differently, so much so that you will both need to take each other's comments with a grain of salt, because I am confident that your respective experiences - even on the same bike - would be quite different. Robert, I think you would have to go considerably faster around a corner (and/or carry a higher lean angle) to get your knee down, compared to Tyler, who has long legs and a lot of flexibility in his riding position. Also I'd hazard a guess that Tyler can more comfortably ride in rearsets that are lower than what would suit Robert.
Another item to consider; Robert, the recommendation to ride at 75% of your ability is for learning, to give you enough free attention to observe your riding or learn a new skill, instead of riding at your absolute limit. That doesn't necessarily mean you have to ride at 75-80% of your ability all the time - it's not a bad idea, because you have some margin for error, but if you are going all out in a race you may not leave that much safety margin. I wonder if Tyler is talking 100% full out pace when you are talking 80%? That distinction would make a difference for me, I am not dragging knee at my 75-80% pace, I have to be going as fast as I can go (OR use bad technique) to get my knee down.
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If you have already signed up for the school, you can probably get the student special discount on the q3s from the school and have them ship them to you, that may be a better deal than you can find locally.
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If you sit UP and back in the saddle, you are putting most of your weight behind the COG, AND putting some of it ion a long lever (the height away from the COG) and it will make the bike more likely to wheelie. However, if you slide your butt back but get into a tuck with your body down low to the tank, you aren't shifting enough weight back to make a big difference, since most of your upper body is still in front of the COG and the weight is low on the bike.One question though. With the riders weight farthest back in the seat would the bike not have a higher probability of lifting the front wheel? When it comes to mental issues that's a big one for me when I realize that 90% of my braking ability just went away and even after the wheel lands it will take a moment for it to settle before I have 100% braking capabilities again.
!
The BMW can power wheelie no matter where you sit, if you throttle on hard enough, but keep in mind that if you do wheelie, the front will come down immediately when you let off the gas. Immediately. There is not a long lag waiting for the front wheel to land. Out of curiosity, have you had the bike wheelie on you? If so, where were you, how high did the wheel lift, etc.?
I asking because, generally speaking, with good throttle control power wheelies are usually low and very smooth, often the rider is unaware the front wheel is off the ground until they feel it come down.
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Trevor's job is called Course Control. As Jeff eloquently explained above, Trevor's role is to keep everyone safe on track. In his briefing he explains how to safely enter and exit the track, the riding and passing rules, and what the course control flags mean. CSS and almost every track organization anywhere (for cars or bikes) utilize corner workers placed at strategic places around the track with flags to communicate with riders on track. The flags are used to let you know all is good (green flag) or something has changed on the track (a yellow flag, which can indicate a distraction or hazard like a rider that has pulled off to the side of the track), etc.
A full description of the typical use of course control flags can be found easily on Google, so I won't detail all of that, but CSS use of flags is fairly standard.
Trevor also covers a few other things like how you are notified when it is your turn to ride the camera bike (2 day camps), any special considerations at certain tracks (like sound control at Laguna), etc.
CSS has phenomenal course control. I don't think any track day, school, or race organization anywhere has put as much thought, effort, and research into keeping riders safe on track as CSS has done. For example, corner workers are not only watching for potential hazards, they are also watching closely for rider errors or problems with riding technique that could lead to a crash, so they help with the coaching process and this ultimately often prevents riders from crashing.
Trevor ensures that CSS students have the best possible riding experience with maximum possible track time.
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Robert, are you feeling forces (like wind or acceleration) that are pulling on you, or is this a mental thing, worrying about the speed itself?
At 120 mph the wind forces are significant. Are you well tucked into the 'bubble' created by the fairings and windscreen? If you are sitting up and trying to see over the top of the windscreen, the wind will pull on you hard and you will have no choice but to hold onto the handlebars tight, no one could keep a light touch on the bars while being dragged backwards by a 120mph wind.
Are your knees tucked in? If you are going around a corner at 100+ mph, sticking your knee out will create a lot of drag and want to twist your body around. Usually it is better to tuck both knees in tight for very high speed sweepers.
Do you scoot all the way back to the stop on the seat in fast straights? You may need to, to get a full tuck. If a full tuck doesn't put you back that far, you may need to add a pad BEHIND you, to give you a backstop. At full acceleration the BMW pulls really hard and you need a support at your butt to keep you from sliding back, otherwise you can end up exhausting yourself trying to hold on.
Are your leathers fitted well? If your leathers catch air and balloon out at the shoulders or back, they can act like a sail and put excess forces on your body at high speed.
If it is strictly a mental thing, if you are just concerned about the speed itself, here are some ideas :
1) tape over your speedo so you can't glance down and see triple digits.
2) get really good earplugs to minimise the roar of the wind, often the most intimidating factor
3) make sure your helmet doesn't do anything goofy at high speeds, like smush into your face.
4) try death gripping the bars ON PURPOSE for a few laps, then on the next lap relax your hands and observe the difference
If you think it is just a mental issue, pay attention to your body and your bike for a few laps and see if you discover that there is something physical going on that is triggering your worries - is the bike shaking or doing something weird? Are you getting pulled back on the bike physically? Are your eyes keeping up with the speed or does everything suddenly feel rushed? Does the sound of the engine or the wind become intimidating? Etc.
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There's been a lot of discussion about body position on the board lately; let's talk about some practical aspects for every day riding. Here's some questions for the group:
What part(s) of the body would a rider typically want to use to anchor securely on the bike?
If a rider is NOT well-anchored on the bike, especially when trying to hang off, what part of the bike does he tend to use to hold himself up?
What is the usual result of using that part of the bike to hold yourself up?
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OK, got it. Thanks for the info; I look forward to getting a liner that works for me, and will get with you asap about figuring out the best way to add padding all around if needed.
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OK...back online...so sorry for the delay.
In fitting any helmet, if it is sitting too low, it can either limit your vertical field of view or "creep" down further as the helmet loosens up. Neither of these things is very desirable, and both are indications that the helmet may be too big.
Properly fitted, the weight of the helmet will be carried around the crown of the rider's head, not on top. If the rider's head is going into the helmet deep enough to "bottom out", the ride height will be wrong. The most general reason that a helmet ends up too big is because the rider is trying to accommodate his/her head shape. If there's forehead pressure or hot spots, going up a size may help, but there could be unforeseen consequences.
Adding foam to the top of the helmet isn't something that we generally recommend. On occasion, a little bit of foam here or there to help "shim up" loose areas can work to ensure stability, but adding enough foam to alter the position of the helmet on the rider's head should be a sign to try the next size down.
Hope this helps.
PP
I have had to do this (add foam at the crown) with every helmet I've had, in multiple brands. I wear an XS helmet size (or XXS if available). Is it actually dangerous to have foam in the crown? If the foam is not recommended, and I am already at the smallest helmet size available, what do I do instead? As I am actively racing, I am (in theory) supposed to be in a new helmet every two years, so getting something custom made (like a smaller liner) is not really practical.
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Great post, Eirik!
In a sorta related story - this weekend, I pulled into the pits from one of my races, and my bike seat pad fell off. (Oops, glad it didn't happen in the race!) I picked it up and was shocked at how heavy it was - it came with the bike and looks like a regular lightweight foam seat, but it was about 5 times heavier than I expected.
So, instead of re-mounting it, I spent some time that night cutting and shaping a new lighter-weight seat from regular race seat foam, proud of myself for saving a bit of weight on my low-HP SuperSingle. I mounted the seat, it was shaped perfectly, and it looked great.
Next morning I went out for practice, and it was awful! This bike vibrates a lot and that thick heavy seat was insulating me from it. The new seat didn't absorb the vibrations and in about 3 laps my legs felt like noodles due to the buzzing of the nerves up near my hip joint - have you ever had your hands go numb from running a weedeater? It was like that, except it was my legs!
I came back to the pits and mounted the old heavy seat. Like Mika said in the quote above.... it is heavy material but at least that weight is DOING something!
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Will (the mechanic) inspects the tires on every school bike every day, he certainly has plenty of experience in that area! The coaches see a lot of different tires on various bikes during tech inspection for students who bring their own bikes - but they are typically in new or nearly-new condition as the school policy requires.
One good place to see all kinds of different tire wear is at the club races! Racers work the tires hard and they are on a budget so many guys will run the tires as long as they can - plus changes in suspension, tire compounds, track surface, or unusual weather (typically on the cold side) can result in some surprising and unexpected wear. Anyone who has ruined or nearly ruined an expensive set of race tires in one or two sessions through cold-tearing know it can be an expensive mistake!
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Perfect example of that desirable "orange peel" wear pattern that we were trying to describe with words, thanks for posting those pics.
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Nice shots, T!
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Glad you had a great time! Since you did level 2 and level 3, I'd be curious to know - which drill would you say helped you the most?
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Great parachute analogy, I agree with this completely.
I never depend on the electronics but I certainly don't mind having them there, just in case something very unexpected happens, or I make a big mistake.
Knee To Knee Why It's Important!
in Cornering and Techniques
Posted
Just a reminder, the purposes of hip-flick include getting across the bike quicker AND not using the bars to pull yourself across the seat (why all know why THAT would be undesirable, right?).
That does not mean you still keep your full weight in the seat while you do it - part of the drill is to use your legs (mainly your quads) to lighten your butt in the seat, to make it easier to slide across, then using your knee/leg to pull your hips across the seat instead of trying to pull yourself across using the bars.
This drill is taught after the knee-to-knee because an important part of the exercise is to keep a solid lock on the bike as you transition.
For a comparison, think about what a typical inexperienced rider would try to do - which would usually be to try to move the upper body first by pulling on the handlebar (which of course creates an unwanted steering input) and then release both legs and hop over the seat with a bounce on the pegs to get the butt to follow. So we have an unnecessary and unwanted steering input followed by an abrupt bounce on the pegs, all of which can create instability in the bike DURING a direction change, at a moment when the rider is poorly locked on the bike.
Hip flick allows the whole transition to happen a lot faster (because your leg is strong and can rapidly and smoothly pull your hips across the bike), keeps you firmly attached to the bike throughout the process (the part that Robert is talking about in his original post!), and eliminates any need to pull on the handlebars. An additional benefit is that since you have at least one knee locked on at all times and you are light in the seat during the transition, you are in a good situation to handle any unexpected bumps or wiggles due to an irregular road surface or loss of traction.