Supposed To "do Nothing"

[Jaybird180]

At least that's the way I remember the drill from L1 :-)

 

Well, I've been focusing on a few things in my riding and it has made me aware of something (along with the discussions of late on simultaneous throttle/ steering inputs). I've noticed that my bar turns-in A LOT more than I previously realized. When I'm not focusing on it, I would hardly even notice, but sometimes I can feel the bars turn in, and feel compelled to countersteer to keep the bike leaned over. I have the feeling that if I add gas that it will stand up, but I know that I'm probably adding an inadvertant steering input.

 

Brings me to this: Am I supposed to be able to feel the bar turn-in? Do I have my geometry all screwed up that's causing this (I do have a funky tire combo right now)? Or am I just becoming aware of something that we discuss in theory?

[Adam06]

Hi Jaybird,

 

As you finish your steering input, and release pressure on the bars, they will turn in, as you have observed. That is precisley what is meant to happen, and if you are relaxed on the bars as you should be, you will feel it. Lower speed tighter turns may be more noticeable, but it occurs in every turn.

 

The new Twist DVD demostrates this phenomenon real well, very early on in the film. A protractor type device is mounted on the tank, and a pointer is attached to the bars. As the bike is steered the bars turn one way (the countersteering input), then as the rider releases pressure on the bar they turn back the other way and the bike arcs through the turn. You can see the pointer move back and forth across the face of the protractor!

 

Your geometry and tyres will have minimal if any effect this.

 

Cheers,

[acebobby]

Hay Jay when you say you feel compelled to countersteer to keep the bike leaned over, what exactly do you mean? Why do you feel the need to do this?

The scene in the twist2 dvd where Cobie is riding the no bs bike and its getting steered from behind shows and proves without a shadow of a doubt that steering inputs are not required, the bike will hold line by being totally relaxed!

 

Bobby

[khp]

At least that's the way I remember the drill from L1 :-)

 

Well, I've been focusing on a few things in my riding and it has made me aware of something (along with the discussions of late on simultaneous throttle/ steering inputs). I've noticed that my bar turns-in A LOT more than I previously realized. When I'm not focusing on it, I would hardly even notice, but sometimes I can feel the bars turn in, and feel compelled to countersteer to keep the bike leaned over. I have the feeling that if I add gas that it will stand up, but I know that I'm probably adding an inadvertant steering input.

Jaybird,

 

One of the errors that my coach Paul spotted on Level two was that I tend to sit rotated around the tank (a big no-no today, but I was told it was the Right Way in '98 and took to it as a fish to water). Now, if I rotate around the tank, I tend to push the inner handlebar (which will stiffen the steering and will give you less feedback from the front tyre - not good).

 

It sounds to me that you're doing either exactly the same, or something else that causes you to push the inside bar. I would suggest that you take a look at how you sit when in the hang-in position. If possible, try to move a little back on the seat and make sure that your shoulders are square to the driving direction (much like if you do alpine skiing) - that might help you to stop pushing the inside bar.

 

Since I've been doing this for 10+ years, it's taking me quite some time to un-learn this and relearn the proper way.

 

Hope this helps,

 

Kai

[Jaybird180]

When I say compelled, I mean that it feels weird to feel the bars turn-in and I feel I need to "correct" it to keep my line. I try to remind myself to do nothing, especially while going around the the HUGE off camber circle near my house. It's wet sometimes and the pavement changes also. Now that I've relaxed my death grip on the bars, I'm aware of the turning-in feeling.

 

Any suggestions for truly relaxing and letting the bike do it's thing while I simply follow TC Rule #1?

[harnois]

Grip the bike with your legs and (to keep things simpler for now) do not hang-off. Once you've finished your countersteer, and you've relax your grip, and the bars have turned in, and you've gone to slightly on-throttle, then like Bobby said, the bike should hold its lean angle with no pressure on the bars.

 

However, it only holds it's lean angle because the bike geometry, tires, etc are designed to work together to make that happen. It is possible for something to be not right about the geometry or tires such that the front wheel will turn in too much or not enough when you relax, and then the bike will not hold its lean angle. For example, when my front tires are kinda worn out in a certain way (from street riding), I notice the bars want to turn in more, which makes the bike want to stand up in the turns. Perhaps your "funky tire combo" is part of the problem, or more likely just a worn front.

[Crash106]

Yes. I agree with the experts. Grip the bike with your outside leg, lean in, then keep trying less and less pressure on the bars and tension in your arms. When I played with relaxing in the turns, I found I became sooo relaxed in the turns that a pelican landed on my arm (not really).