Lean Angle, Body Postion And Speed

[spthomas]

I had a track day Saturday and things have progressed but I'm still having trouble in turn 2 which is a 90-degree right turn (turn 1 is a 60-deg right turn and they are connected).

 

The problem I'm struggling with is dragging hard parts on the right side. So I what I was doing was making sure I'm leaning off properly and keeping low- so when I do that I don't drag but I feel like since the bike itself is a bit more upright, the radius of my turn is larger and not as tight. Is that just a mis-perception? I was hitting my apex OK. I know leaning off keeps the bike more upright even though the composite bike+rider lean is the same for a given speed, but the bike's lean angle and thus steering does change.

 

I want/need to faster through that corner but I feel like I'm up against physical limits.

 

(I'm so ready for level 3!)

[johnnyrod]

Which track were you at? Are you running both bends together like one big one of decreasing radius? Is that the best line, or better to treat them as two separate turns? How many apices, and whereabouts on the track?

[Cobie Fair]

I had a track day Saturday and things have progressed but I'm still having trouble in turn 2 which is a 90-degree right turn (turn 1 is a 60-deg right turn and they are connected).

 

The problem I'm struggling with is dragging hard parts on the right side. So I what I was doing was making sure I'm leaning off properly and keeping low- so when I do that I don't drag but I feel like since the bike itself is a bit more upright, the radius of my turn is larger and not as tight. Is that just a mis-perception? I was hitting my apex OK. I know leaning off keeps the bike more upright even though the composite bike+rider lean is the same for a given speed, but the bike's lean angle and thus steering does change.

 

I want/need to faster through that corner but I feel like I'm up against physical limits.

 

(I'm so ready for level 3!)

 

 

Did you do Level 2 yet (I'm assuming, but just checking...). If so, did you ride the lean bike? Lastly, wonder if you are a bit tight on the bars?

 

CF

[Thumper748]

Hi Stevo,

I posted a similar scenario on a tight right hand corner after a fast straight.

I took a different bike (naked bike) the following track day with flat/upright bars and the corner was much less of a concern.

Why I think what may worked for me was:

1. The seating position on the naked bike put less stress on my wrists

2. Less stress in my wrists meant I was more relaxed

3. Being more relaxed meant I could turn in quicker and with more confidence

4. Being more relaxed on the bars also meant for me that could look into the next corner better opening up my vision

 

After a few session on improved my lap times by 3 seconds – on a bike with close 30hp less.

 

So, this doesn't mean I'm now going to swap bikes but it has helped me work out what works best for the particular corner and now all I have to get this technique right on my regular ride.

 

I'm not at all fast or a pro-rider but maybe some of this can assist with any similar scenarios other riders are also experiencing.

 

Mr. Slow.

[spthomas]

Did you do Level 2 yet (I'm assuming, but just checking...). If so, did you ride the lean bike? Lastly, wonder if you are a bit tight on the bars?

 

CF

I did level 2 at VIR last May, but we didn't do the lean bike because of the rain although we sat on a static bike in the barn. (At level 3 can I try it!?) I don't think I'm tight on the bars, but maybe I am at that point since I've scraped a number of times.

[faffi]

Interesting comment on the taller bars - many moons ago, MOTORRAD tested a Kawasaki ZXR750 with stock handlebars and a 4 inch raiser kit. Everybody was noticeably faster through the slalom with the taller set bars, and only the active racer was marginally (a few tenths) faster around the race track with the stock setup, everybody else in the team went quicker with the raised bars. And even the racer admitted he had far more leverage with the raised bars.

[spthomas]

Which track were you at? Are you running both bends together like one big one of decreasing radius? Is that the best line, or better to treat them as two separate turns? How many apices, and whereabouts on the track?

The track is Putnam Park. If you look at the map in the link, you go right to left on the long straight. Turns 1 and 2 are somewhat separate but really 1-4 are all linked.

 

So we are saying more leverage on bars etc. is better because if the bike is more upright for a given radius of turn, you have to turn the front a bit further? I suppose that makes sense.

[johnnyrod]

Interesting one. Turn 2 looks tighter than turn 1 but both are fairly simple (to my eyes) bends. They're far enough apart that you'll want to drift right out to the left of the track between turns. I'd reckon if they were isolated then you'd have to take turn 2 slower than turn 1, so i'm not sure that better speed of turn-in (time to get the bike over) would really help you out in turn 2 anyway. Also looks like if it helps you keep the bike more stable (it's more comfortable to you) then a late apex from turn 1 (or maybe a wider apex then the inside kerb at the half-way round point) would send you into turn 2 with almost no break between the turns, at about the right radius/lean angle/speed. To put it another way, slightly slower through turn 1 would set you up for turn 2 with little or no extra inputs required (they become one long bend), and maybe this would be a faster thing for you to do; once the bike is on its side, you can't tell it to do much more to go around a bend faster, if you're already hanging off the inside and using all the track. Either that or go through turn 1 as fast as you can (you're not dragging anything yet so I presume you can go a bit quicker) and try to lose a little speed before entering turn 2. In a race you'd probably rather do that as a late apex into turn 1 is probably asking to get passed a lot on the brakes.

 

Would be very intersted to know what the proper guys have to say, this sort of thing cooks my noodle at many a track.