dbtriple Posted September 14, 2009 Report Share Posted September 14, 2009 Dear helpful readers. Completed a ride day at Eastern Creek last Friday. Despite my best intentions, I didn't ignore the argy-bargy of the race track and work on the drills I had decided on for the day, it just turned out to mostly be "trying to catch that bastard who just got past me "! OK, I did try and work a bit on setting corner speed through better braking, and relaxing on the bike, but you know how it goes! Anyway, my observations of those who were going consistently fast had one thing in common - that being the body positioning. I was going as fast as those who didn't get their arses off the seats, but all those who passed me had the cheek off the seat or knee down. So I suppose I'm looking for a bit of reassurance that level 3 will give me the ammo to take on these knee down devils on a common footing! I just felt I was outgunned out there, not the bike, which I reckon would have to be at least competitive, but in the technical department, namely body positioning which I have alluded to earlier. Can it be learned by all? How can I be persuaded to loosen my arse-grip on the seat? It doesn't feel that good......probably doing it wrong. In addition to this, since I have a speed triple, with relatively high bars, I was wondering if adding clipons would be a way of aiding body positioning via lowering body height? thanks in advance. ps I didn't put this under the track day section, since I didn't consider it a success! regards db Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hubbard_28 Posted September 15, 2009 Report Share Posted September 15, 2009 The answer about your query regarding BP and the fast guys is simple: it's not the BP that's making them faster, but their experience. They've learned more than just BP during their time on the track, and you're seeing the results of that. I usually have pretty good BP, and some people who pass me do so with their heads where the outside mirror would be they're so crossed up, or they're not really crouched down. There are some BP positions that change the bikes functionality, and it takes adjustment on your managing the bike to get used to it. With time you'll become more comfortable at leaning and cornering, and you'll have worked on your BP so that you're at their level. Just try to mimic what they do slowly and you'll get the hang of it, and when it comes time for you to make some bigger adjustments, you'll be able to do it without much thought. Take a few riders for example. Haga will never get all the way down to the tank. He just doesn't. Mladin and Hodgson have almost the same BP, and it's horrible as far as professional riding goes. You can put Larry Pegram in that group as well. Spies and Lascourz get all the way down like you're probably talking about, and they're both doing great, but who's to say they wouldn't do as well if they were sitting up more. I saw Aquino race out at Firebird Raceway in Phoenix, and he had good BP, but he didn't look anything like Josh Herrin, as he does now. I'm guessing same coach. It's only advice, but I'd recommend making small adjustments to BP and focusing on those drills. I've spent lots of time focusing on BP, and yesterday watched a friend who put his focus on riding race in the amateur group. He was mixing it up with the advanced riders, and will be an advanced racer next season. And his BP sucks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acebobby Posted September 15, 2009 Report Share Posted September 15, 2009 Dear helpful readers. Completed a ride day at Eastern Creek last Friday. Despite my best intentions, I didn't ignore the argy-bargy of the race track and work on the drills I had decided on for the day, it just turned out to mostly be "trying to catch that bastard who just got past me "! OK, I did try and work a bit on setting corner speed through better braking, and relaxing on the bike, but you know how it goes! Anyway, my observations of those who were going consistently fast had one thing in common - that being the body positioning. I was going as fast as those who didn't get their arses off the seats, but all those who passed me had the cheek off the seat or knee down. So I suppose I'm looking for a bit of reassurance that level 3 will give me the ammo to take on these knee down devils on a common footing! I just felt I was outgunned out there, not the bike, which I reckon would have to be at least competitive, but in the technical department, namely body positioning which I have alluded to earlier. Can it be learned by all? How can I be persuaded to loosen my arse-grip on the seat? It doesn't feel that good......probably doing it wrong. In addition to this, since I have a speed triple, with relatively high bars, I was wondering if adding clipons would be a way of aiding body positioning via lowering body height? thanks in advance. ps I didn't put this under the track day section, since I didn't consider it a success! regards db Hi db I have done the same in the past, go out to a trackday with the intentions of working on specific drills, then end up riding on the raged edge trying to keep up with faster guys, and learning nothing in the process! Dont do it, track time is not only expensive but you just dont get enough of it to waste time, you may not even know the experience of the guys that are passing you, so forget everyone else out there and focus on yourself, work on the drills you are familiar with, the ones you have been taught, if you haven't done L3 yet dont waste to much attention on body position unless you are dragging hard parts leaned over, work on your L1 drills, pick a drill to concentrate on and spend a session doing it! For me I pick 1 or 2 drills for each session throughout the day, usually my first session is focused on throttle control and visual skills, working on this gives me comfortable lines to use, remember a good line is one where TC rule #1 can be applied, and as far as visual skills are concerned, this has given me the biggest break through in my riding! I work on specific drills throughout the day, and on my last session I just have a bit of fun and dont really focus on any specific drill, but the ones I have been working on just feel more natural, on every track day I have done, by the last session the fast guys dont seem so fast anymore! Bobby Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbtriple Posted September 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 Thanks for the help fellas! Just booked level 3 December 10 at Eastern creek, will have a dig before then though! db Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam06 Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 Db, Yes, level 3 will give you some ammo to use against those "knee down devils", and alot of it will relate to how you use your body in your interaction with the bike. Happy riding until we see you in December! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harnois Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 I've ridden similar style bikes with the higher handlebars. I have an SV650 for street use with those kind of bars. Then I have a gsxr750 dedicated track bike. And yeah I do think getting lower bars for track use would be beneficial, if you want to start hanging off. It is generally awkward in my opinion to try to get off the side and low with the bars up high like that, but you can do it. And, one very important thing about hanging off is doing it without supporting your own weight on the handlebars. This can be kinda challenging at first, and one thing I like to do to aid this is sortof hook my outside elbow into the edge of the tank. I don't think this would be possible with higher bars. You might consider some bars like these as a compromise: http://suburban-machinery.com/hbindex.htm not quite as low as clip-ons, but a lot lower than stock, and there's a couple options, one a little lower than the other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbtriple Posted September 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 17, 2009 Thanks for the tip mate. I think I should just get a track bike.......keep the speedy for the road! Cheers db Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harnois Posted September 17, 2009 Report Share Posted September 17, 2009 Thanks for the tip mate. I think I should just get a track bike.......keep the speedy for the road! Cheers db Yeah if you can swing it that's definitely the way to go. It might be hard to find but you can get track bikes for some pretty surprisingly small amounts of money if you aren't super picky about having the latest model stuff. I just got a track bike for only $2400, it's a 2000 gsxr600 with a 2002 gsxr750 FI motor, an Ohlins rear shock, inverted forks from the 750, airtech track bodywork, it's a "looks great from 10 feet away" kind of bike. Not the latest equipment but a great trackday bike and the suspension is better than even the latest model stock bikes, and the power of the 750 still beats today's 600s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hubbard_28 Posted September 18, 2009 Report Share Posted September 18, 2009 I found out on my wife's EX-650 that the bars are in the way. I still love the shape of the tank, and think I can melt into it better than my bike, except for those handlebars. I've put a lower one on, but it's still not the same as clip-ons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobie Fair Posted September 18, 2009 Report Share Posted September 18, 2009 Thanks for the tip mate. I think I should just get a track bike.......keep the speedy for the road! Cheers db Those Triumphs are fun, but wouldn't be my first choice for a serious track bike. You could try one of the school's hire bikes as an option too. Something to consider. Level 3 will work on your body quite a bit, and your lower body will get worked over nicel--if you don't already, a little conditioning work can help prepare you (bicycle riding is good for one). Best, CF Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbtriple Posted September 20, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 20, 2009 Thanks for the tip mate. I think I should just get a track bike.......keep the speedy for the road! Cheers db Those Triumphs are fun, but wouldn't be my first choice for a serious track bike. You could try one of the school's hire bikes as an option too. Something to consider. Level 3 will work on your body quite a bit, and your lower body will get worked over nicel--if you don't already, a little conditioning work can help prepare you (bicycle riding is good for one). Best, CF Dear Cobie, I'm 6 foot 6 tall, so the 600cc bikes are a little on the small side. I'll just keep the triple going for now, I know it's not a serious track bike but it'll have to do me! I'm already preparing the legs for the onslaught of activity which awaits. regards db Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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