khp Posted December 31, 2009 Report Share Posted December 31, 2009 Since 2002, I've been using Metzeler Sportec M1 and Roadtec Z6's 2002/2003 Yamaha YZF-R1. The M1/Z6 tires have always given me a lot of grip and lots of confidence in both dry and wet conditions. This year, in preparation for my CSS Level 1 & 2, I bought a new set of tires - Sportec M3's (front + rear). While the old M1's were very neutral and didn't move from lines in the tarmac until they were quite worn, the new M3's felt "nervous" from day one. With the new M3, the confidence is gone (even though there's clearly lots of grip available, even at full lean). The bike becomes very sensitive to longitudinal tarmac changes and white stripes. Also, when turning in the bike, the front feels like it's twitching as if it cannot decide what lean angle to settle on. I've been in talking with Metzeler customer support (they actually called me up!) and they explained that this is as expected, due to different constructions of the M1 and M3 tires - basically the M3 is more pointed, which makes it more "nervous". After a season of driving the M3's, I've decided that I want the old behaviour back. I could go back to the M1's but since a lot of development is happening in compounds and Silica contents these years, I'd rather look forward than back, when choosing a new tire. So here's my question: which tires would you recommend, given the above? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobie Fair Posted December 31, 2009 Report Share Posted December 31, 2009 Hi KHP, You would of couse realize I'm giving a biased view, as Dunlop is our sponsor, and has been--forever. Also, not sure what's available to you... It's been a while since I've had any Metzlers, or really ridden on them, so no intimate knowledge there (hope we get some others sounding off on the plus/minus of the tires you mention). I can comment on what I think could be a similarity: for many years on my street bike I would use race tires (take offs). What I got to like was a closer to a slick profile, a bit more pointy. This allowed the bike to be turned easier, but was a bit nervous in a straight line, especially over the rain grooves we have here on the freeways. I didn't really mind it moving around, and figured it was a good trade off for ultimate grip. Pretty sure I was just fooling myself and I eventually learned they never got up to working temp--I don't ride hard enough around town to get the heat in them. That brings us to the current Qualifiers. I've chased students at our race school, they on our school bikes with Qualifiers, me on a coach bike with race tires. Once we got the tire pressure sorted (we were too high to start with), the Q's were no disadvantage for a fast rider. And they take less time to warm up. A better alround choice for sure. Another plus for you, they are not nervous at all, very nicely go over just about anything. I still personally like a more pointed profile (for ease of turning), but happily take the pluses that outweigh that. And there is my biased opinion. Best, Cobie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobie Fair Posted December 31, 2009 Report Share Posted December 31, 2009 Hi KHP, You would of couse realize I'm giving a biased view, as Dunlop is our sponsor, and has been--forever. Also, not sure what's available to you... It's been a while since I've had any Metzlers, or really ridden on them, so no intimate knowledge there (hope we get some others sounding off on the plus/minus of the tires you mention). I can comment on what I think could be a similarity: for many years on my street bike I would use race tires (take offs). What I got to like was a closer to a slick profile, a bit more pointy. This allowed the bike to be turned easier, but was a bit nervous in a straight line, especially over the rain grooves we have here on the freeways. I didn't really mind it moving around, and figured it was a good trade off for ultimate grip. Pretty sure I was just fooling myself and I eventually learned they never got up to working temp--I don't ride hard enough around town to get the heat in them. That brings us to the current Qualifiers. I've chased students at our race school, they on our school bikes with Qualifiers, me on a coach bike with race tires. Once we got the tire pressure sorted (we were too high to start with), the Q's were no disadvantage for a fast rider. And they take less time to warm up. A better alround choice for sure. Another plus for you, they are not nervous at all, very nicely go over just about anything. I still personally like a more pointed profile (for ease of turning), but happily take the pluses that outweigh that. And there is my biased opinion. Best, Cobie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobie Fair Posted December 31, 2009 Report Share Posted December 31, 2009 Hi KHP, You would of couse realize I'm giving a biased view, as Dunlop is our sponsor, and has been--forever. Also, not sure what's available to you... It's been a while since I've had any Metzlers, or really ridden on them, so no intimate knowledge there (hope we get some others sounding off on the plus/minus of the tires you mention). I can comment on what I think could be a similarity: for many years on my street bike I would use race tires (take offs). What I got to like was a closer to a slick profile, a bit more pointy. This allowed the bike to be turned easier, but was a bit nervous in a straight line, especially over the rain grooves we have here on the freeways. I didn't really mind it moving around, and figured it was a good trade off for ultimate grip. Pretty sure I was just fooling myself and I eventually learned they never got up to working temp--I don't ride hard enough around town to get the heat in them. That brings us to the current Qualifiers. I've chased students at our race school, they on our school bikes with Qualifiers, me on a coach bike with race tires. Once we got the tire pressure sorted (we were too high to start with), the Q's were no disadvantage for a fast rider. And they take less time to warm up. A better alround choice for sure. Another plus for you, they are not nervous at all, very nicely go over just about anything. I still personally like a more pointed profile (for ease of turning), but happily take the pluses that outweigh that. And there is my biased opinion. Best, Cobie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spthomas Posted December 31, 2009 Report Share Posted December 31, 2009 That brings us to the current Qualifiers. I've chased students at our race school, they on our school bikes with Qualifiers, me on a coach bike with race tires. Once we got the tire pressure sorted (we were too high to start with), the Q's were no disadvantage for a fast rider. And they take less time to warm up. A better alround choice for sure. I can't comment on Metzlers; I don't know anyone using them. I can say as a user of the Dunlop Qualifiers that I'm happy with them for both track and street riding. My track day buddy has an R1 with Michelins and he has traction problems in places I don't, although that could be him getting on the throttle too hard in places (but I'm not slower ). Cobie- any feedback on the new Q2's yet? My impression is that is a successor to the Qualifier- is that right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozfireblade Posted January 1, 2010 Report Share Posted January 1, 2010 Hi KHP, Ive used most types of tyres from pilot powers, bridgestones and the super corsa III. Out of those three I preferred the bridgestone. I have always stayed away from dunlop q's, not sure why maybe because of the dodgy dunlop volleys that people wear( shoes). I thought as the school recommends them and like Cobie says the school has used them forever I'd give em a go, I am more than happy the q's and Im looking forward to the q2 being releasesd in australia soon. Once I'd put them on I found them very quick to warm up very sticky and I was confident riding on them straight away, havent had any rain to ride on yet so can't say how grippy they are in that scenario. not sure if that helps much but there ya go Dylan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khp Posted January 1, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 1, 2010 That brings us to the current Qualifiers. I've chased students at our race school, they on our school bikes with Qualifiers, me on a coach bike with race tires. Once we got the tire pressure sorted (we were too high to start with), the Q's were no disadvantage for a fast rider. And they take less time to warm up. A better alround choice for sure. It's exactly the alround choice I'm looking for here. Just a clarifying question: are you referring to the 'plain' Qualifier or the Qualifier RR tires? Ive used most types of tyres from pilot powers, bridgestones and the super corsa III. Out of those three I preferred the bridgestone. Which Bridgestones are you using? - my problem with the bridgestones is that there are so many models to choose from (bt-002, bt-014, bt-015, and -016) and their website don't line them up the way Dunlop do. The Michelin PowerOne tires & website has the same issue - basically too many variants to choose from, even with their selector website. Thanks to all for chiming in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozfireblade Posted January 2, 2010 Report Share Posted January 2, 2010 That brings us to the current Qualifiers. I've chased students at our race school, they on our school bikes with Qualifiers, me on a coach bike with race tires. Once we got the tire pressure sorted (we were too high to start with), the Q's were no disadvantage for a fast rider. And they take less time to warm up. A better alround choice for sure. It's exactly the alround choice I'm looking for here. Just a clarifying question: are you referring to the 'plain' Qualifier or the Qualifier RR tires? Ive used most types of tyres from pilot powers, bridgestones and the super corsa III. Out of those three I preferred the bridgestone. Which Bridgestones are you using? - my problem with the bridgestones is that there are so many models to choose from (bt-002, bt-014, bt-015, and -016) and their website don't line them up the way Dunlop do. The Michelin PowerOne tires & website has the same issue - basically too many variants to choose from, even with their selector website. Thanks to all for chiming in. No worries, Now they have the bt 003's, I was using the bt 015 thought about the bt 016, now using the qualifier as australia hasnt released the q2 yet. From using both tyres I think they're quite similar in how they handle although the dunlop seems to be softer and balls up better, maybe thats from finally sorting my suspension out. I get confused re: tyres as there is so much advancement with compounds etc I'll just keep it simple from now on and use dunlop or bridgestones...or if someone sends me a new set of tyres to try i'll find out that way...try and test it yourself I guess. Dylan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jasonzilla Posted January 2, 2010 Report Share Posted January 2, 2010 When I started doing track I had Pilot Powers, and have used them since. I didn't want to use anything else, because I trusted those, and didn't want to risk ending up with lesser tires. When I did the school, it was on the same type of bike I own (ZX6R) with the Dunlops, and I'm trying as hard as I can to wear down this set of Pilot Powers so I can get some Dunlops. The Dunlops we were using at school were insane. I've never had the amount of trust in my Pilot Powers as I had in the Dunlops after the first few sessions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobie Fair Posted January 2, 2010 Report Share Posted January 2, 2010 We don't have Qualifier RR's (not to my knowledge anyway). CF Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tgriff1222 Posted January 3, 2010 Report Share Posted January 3, 2010 I've got qualifiers on my r1. Very predictable tire in various conditions and road surfaces. I've run them in the rain both on street and for a track day and was happy with them. At the track it rained in the morning and dried throughout the day and the was impressed with how they handle the mixed conditions. Good stuff! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khp Posted January 3, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 3, 2010 I've got qualifiers on my r1. Very predictable tire in various conditions and road surfaces. I've run them in the rain both on street and for a track day and was happy with them. At the track it rained in the morning and dried throughout the day and the was impressed with how they handle the mixed conditions. Good stuff! Qualifiers it is! - found them on sale online (€182 including shipping - must be around €80 down on normal), probably a clearance sale thing before the new Q2's arrive. /Tanner: great avatar there. Is that a 2002-2003 model you have as well? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tgriff1222 Posted January 4, 2010 Report Share Posted January 4, 2010 I've got qualifiers on my r1. Very predictable tire in various conditions and road surfaces. I've run them in the rain both on street and for a track day and was happy with them. At the track it rained in the morning and dried throughout the day and the was impressed with how they handle the mixed conditions. Good stuff! Qualifiers it is! - found them on sale online (€182 including shipping - must be around €80 down on normal), probably a clearance sale thing before the new Q2's arrive. /Tanner: great avatar there. Is that a 2002-2003 model you have as well? thanks! It's a 2006. I had a sweet r6 but then I saw the r1 in the king kenny colors and had to have it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.