Jaybird180 Posted February 21 Report Share Posted February 21 2 hours ago, gpounce32768 said: Twist2 dvd content is substantially different than audiobook but the track footage on it is great. The DVD isn’t a reenactment of the book’s material but more an evolution, IMO. So, the audiobook would be a spoken version of the book. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobie Fair Posted February 21 Author Report Share Posted February 21 So here's what happened: the audio versions of the books are somewhat unknown gold-mines. Keith does read the book to you, but if there had been additional discoveries in the years since the books had been released, he would include that in the audio book. If you know Keith for any length of time, you realize the guy never stops his research. Only a portion is released to the public, and of the material released to the senior coaches, there are still many topics that are in pilot status--meaning, he's still working them over. Right now we are looking at a training evolution (internal) that could change/improve the way we train our coaches...crazy cool, stay tuned! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gpounce32768 Posted February 22 Report Share Posted February 22 IIRC just as predicted in Twist 1, I had my copy pilfered by a rider friend- he's a Ninja rider, so to be expected 😄 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobie Fair Posted February 23 Author Report Share Posted February 23 Yes, book thieves!!!! Bastards (or pals, depending on how it rolls) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobie Fair Posted March 5 Author Report Share Posted March 5 OK, there is another fine point on efficiency that can be used, but only on sport bikes (meaning not on a cruiser). That is the Pivot Steering technique. It's in Twist 2, any one care to summarize what it is, and how it would be a benefit? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gpounce32768 Posted March 7 Report Share Posted March 7 Push down on the outside peg to anchor the foot along with calf and knee against the outside of the bike, which acts to secure and support the torso so, it, with the shoulder and inside hand, work together more strongly to initiate the steering. The additional low outside weight offsets some high inside weight which reduces the net rotational force in play while the turn-in happens. It also promotes projection of the body weight towards the inside of the turn, so the bike/rider center-of-mass can move inside slightly which reduces the bike's lean. The amount of the push down on the peg is fairly low, perhaps a strong flex of the outside leg's quad muscles, not enough to substantially reduce seat weight. Though I'm not personally interested in knee down and so on, I imagine having a securely planted outside foot & leg makes it easier to do other things with the inside leg since it is not as involved with holding onto the bike. I found the technique more relevant on the R6 than on my old Bandit and current GSXS1k but useful on those also in that it promotes a systematic approach to seating and control inputs in a corner. Even on those latter two bikes its possible to push down on the outside peg a bit and use the secure footing to lean the torso slightly without needing the bars for leverage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobie Fair Posted March 11 Author Report Share Posted March 11 GP, pretty good summary! A bonus question for you: why does this technique not work on cruisers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gpounce32768 Posted March 12 Report Share Posted March 12 Generally the pegs are too far forward for much in the way of of pressure by the legs. Some of the point of the pivot steering is to push against the peg, which is far enough back, so there is a more direct line of force from peg through the torso and shoulders. With pegs forward, the feet are not conveniently located- sort of like trying to stand up out of a chair vs standing up out of a crouch. But I would offer that the technique is relevant on any bike in that it gives the outside leg something specific to do relative to the torso, while the bike is being steered. Otherwise, as I found as a newbie rider, the legs and balance can be doing any old random stuff on this turn vs the last; sometimes pushing the bike up with the inside knee for instance, sometimes leaning, sometimes hauling on the bars to change the lean. Even if pressure on the peg isn't especially relevant wrt bike stability, doing well-defined things with the legs and torso makes cornering methodical, which certainly speaks to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobie Fair Posted March 12 Author Report Share Posted March 12 Lots of good points, but one question: can the bike be pushed up by the inside leg/knee? Don't think this is possible... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gpounce32768 Posted March 13 Report Share Posted March 13 Pushed up in the sense of the inside leg levering the torso inwards so the bike tends to stand up, sure... I guess it depends on how much fiddling around you want to do at turn entry. But using the pivot steer and 2 step to get out of the habit of that sort of thing is part of the benefit of the methods. Since the weather is finally getting civilized I rode to work today, very rusty having only a few good days for the last several months. I noticed a tendency for kinds of random body and leg stuff instead of a clean clamp off the outside peg w/ a slight torso lean in and no pressure on the bars other than the steering motion- so back to the drills. But its not all bad, I had pretty good corner speed on various test corners and my "hot" sweeper up to the highway. OTOH it looks like a reasonable stretch of good weather coming so I should be sharpened up a bit when you all come out to NJ 😀 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobie Fair Posted March 14 Author Report Share Posted March 14 Sounds good, we are looking forward to getting back East and riding there, and VIR! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lebedo Posted April 20 Report Share Posted April 20 On 2/13/2024 at 12:58 AM, Cobie Fair said: Good points all. Does anyone recall, but somewhere Keith mentions an 8th survival reaction...I think it's in the Twist 2 video...anyone know where it is? Just found it...I guess. Rider stability and body positioning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gpounce32768 Posted April 21 Report Share Posted April 21 Perhaps in the sense of exaggerated and/or abrupt changes in posture to try to make something happen, or prevent it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobie Fair Posted April 23 Author Report Share Posted April 23 Do you guys have the minute this is on the video? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hotfoot Posted April 27 Report Share Posted April 27 On 4/22/2024 at 6:17 PM, Cobie Fair said: Do you guys have the minute this is on the video? It's at 13:09 in the video, the sequence showing a rider running off the road due to a series of SR-induced errors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobie Fair Posted April 28 Author Report Share Posted April 28 😁 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gpounce32768 Posted May 12 Report Share Posted May 12 On 5/26/2023 at 9:37 AM, Jaybird180 said: So, as I age I have to remember that my bad habits are insidious and I don’t get enough track time for the improvement I want. I was looking for another quote to reply to, but this one is immediately relevant. I attended the May 10 NJ Level 1 course, and the above very clearly expressed my feelings at the time. When I first discovered Twist 1 and 2 over 15yrs ago I was an immediate convert and have been more or less practicing them since. BUT, it took maybe the first session to become very aware that I had been misapplying them. Which is to to say, pushing for too much too often. Turns out the application of the turn, the selection of turn point vs apex or "proto apex" is more subtle than what I had been doing. Making that clear took the coaching and instruction CSB provided- having my coach bring me off track for very specific suggestions right in the moment was invaluable. The Twist instructions related to reducing speed to clarify cornering became immediately relevant later in the day; in my last two (wet) sessions I reduced speed a lot- which is to say, I stopped pushing, so as to focus on turnpoint, line, throttle and that made a world of difference. I think it took a controlled track situation to make this clear, despite having a selection of local practice corners on my usual commute. It seems the usual commute ride becomes a bit insidious, the apparently correct responses turn into truth without being tested on the track where I found my responses leading me into a variety of errors. The last few laps of the 5th session were profound in a meditative way. I was behind a slow guy, I realized I could pass but I really wasn't into it. Instead I just let him be up front, and instead found a calm and confident place where I could see the turnpoint come up in my peripherals while I was looking at the apex/protoapex and then putting in that very delicate countersteer and clean well-defined throttle. I found some places used more throttle than others, sometimes it was quite gradual- but not choppy and seldom static. Moving from the "hitch" adjustments of line and throttle based on fear to deepening the lean at the right moment to achieve lane position on exit was very satisfying. I'm inclined to think that the perception of the delicate and nuanced countersteer motion is the most interesting result of the class vs the usual forceful and complicated push I had been doing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobie Fair Posted May 13 Author Report Share Posted May 13 Hi GP, What a terrific result! I’d add a bit more, but will wait till I don’t have to thumb type 😁. Best, Cobie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hotfoot Posted May 14 Report Share Posted May 14 Wow, GP, very interesting observations, good for you for being so observant and really thinking things through. Very pleased to hear you got such good results from coming to the school and from the immediate coach feedback. For ANY level of rider it can be tough not to "push for too much too often". I re-read A Twist of the Wrist recently, from cover to cover (working on a soon-to-be-available Spanish language e-book version) and reading the parts about really making a plan for every practice session and being specific about exactly what to change rather than just pushing and hoping things will work out was a great reminder to me about how to approach my riding, especially after some time off, like a winter break. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gpounce32768 Posted May 14 Report Share Posted May 14 Yeah, I like the plan concept vs just going out to try and be fast or "good". I'm inclined to do a second Level 1 with my own bike now that I have a bit of experience being out on track. I definitely need more repetition of the cornering instruction. The current ride is a standard posture bike but subtle quick steer, two-step, gas apply just as much. I didn't find I needed to do anything along the lines of pivot steering, securely but not excessively gripping the tank with the knees and thighs was enough to make projecting the torso inside repeatable. I suppose I wasn't going fast enough to need much braking but I did use them a few times, thankfully as per the Twist recommendation to get the braking done before the steering. Frequently just touching them was enough. I did buy the photo package- its been good to have "hero" shots to send to friends and family 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobie Fair Posted May 18 Author Report Share Posted May 18 GP, I'm a big fan of re-doing the levels, there is so much in them. I don't have your info to hand, so don't know if you made it to Level 2 yet. If there isn't a big gap between schools, consider moving onto Level 2, and then maybe re-doing 1 (and 2?) again. There are some added skills in L2 that can really make it better/easier/possible to do the L1 skills. No minus either way, and if you want to discuss, call the office anytime (or email me) we'll work out a time to chat. CF Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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